Gadgetory

hello everyone and welcome to the 404 show today is Friday September 9 my name is not Jeff Bakalar my name is Russ rustic and I'm not joined by Jeff Bakalar i'm joined by chris plante of the verge who has joined us out of the kindness of his heart while Jeff is on honeymoon somewhere in the Alps I believe welcome Chris I I would rather be where he is yeah it's somewhere not in America okay hey my man yelps Alps is not in America right sure yeah that leaves a lot of places yeah let's name them okay Tokyo Spain mm London Barcelona okay I think we've officially lost half the audience well indeed welcome everyone pretty big week for technology we've been in a bit of a dry spell the last few weeks / months in terms of like big tech news certainly there's been speculation and stuff like that that's been going on but there hasn't been anything like concrete until this week when it all sort of came tumbling down upon us obviously the apple press conference called immediately thereafter by the Saudi press conference and there was a lot of stuff that came out of that so I guess you know this being a tech podcast let's dig into Apple a bit Chris do you know that there was an apple press conference this week it turns out I do because it's my job don't care good well I don't know if it's your job to care but it is your job to watch it write about it so yeah y SE care i mean like be available emotionally to cover it and not just like crawl under my desk and weep what's the sort of five-minute speed on what they announced I don't even do five minutes to an elevator I'm in an elevator with you have just gotten in okay i'm holding in a fart so i'm trying to be very polite okay tell me what just got announced at Apple ok here is the elevator pitch we're pressing the 19th floor now the doors are closing okay so there's a new Apple watch and if you care about Apple watches that's probably a thing and if you don't there's nothing so special about it you're gonna be like oh man finally now I can get that Apple watch is it like is there literally anything sorry to jump in is there literally anything about the Apple watch that would like maybe cause someone to be like okay I'm getting one now has like GPS features like no I right I personally don't understand who the Apple watch is for sure but the elevator is moving up we'll get back to that okay um there's also more importantly the iphone 7 yes and the month sighs iphone 7 and the big change here big change is that it's faster it comes and the old kind of like Darth Vader mask black which apparently scratches easier the feelers and uh there's also an improved camera yet again especially on the larger phone which has the like a telephoto lens to go 100 melenz yeah and it uses artificial intelligence to create images that in theory look as good as say using like a mid-range compact camera like a fuji x100 t which is a camera that i recommend really you think it's comparable to that no i don't but like that's what people are saying that's also article with artificial intelligence really i mean that's that's the line from me life from the Apple precedent right yeah that we thought they were gonna take over the world but instead they're just making our pictures a little nicer that's gonna be in their quest to make our pictures nicer they'll accidentally take over the world yes um yeah and it and there's also no headphone jack anymore um there's just the Lightning port and if you want to charge your phone well also using traditional headphones wired headphones you have to get a special dongle for that which if that sounds awful wait till you see a photo of it it's just as mad as you picture um it looks like a compact flash reader that's how big that dong yes its enormous I don't want to say this is a deal-breaker because this phone is like still it's still a great iphone right like I phones are still yeah if you like distance yourself from all of the hype and the annual releases in yada yada yada like it still is this like tiny little slab of like few metal and future that you put in your pocket and it does all these wonderful things yeah that said there are a lot of other slabs that are comparable um and don't I it just feels so hostile taking away my headphone jack and i know that there's a dongle and i know that i will lose it immediately because i lose anything that is smaller than like my pinky finger yeah uh just I don't know I I I didn't I have not made a pre-order on this phone and the reason why is that I'm just not sure that I like the idea of not being able to plug into my phone without knowing where add-on was it all day did you mention the water resistant aspects of it yes its watering industrious tened is the claim I am curious how true that is as someone who has had to clean out grime from life beat the app be what is it the Lightning port well a paper clip before right so why would that be any there is the same court right yeah i mean i don't know i'm curious to see if people have that problem it's a space-age polymer perhaps mmm yes it's probably a space-age polymer i saw in the commercial the only representation of the waterproofness was I guess they threw a water balloon at it and that looks pretty good I mean I wouldn't normally do that with my phone so I guess that's a plus but the headphone thing I mean you you were questioning whether it's a deal breaker I think for me it's a deal breaker like I think that is acceptable I am like like we've talked about a lot on the show like I'm a big apple phone guy I like Apple compute as well and but I every single day when I use my phone I am plugging in my headphones that I like and are comfortable and don't need a battery and the idea of giving that up in favor of some features which are like nice but not at all mandatory seems totally crazy yeah totally crazy like cutting off your ear despite your face or whatever yeah and I know people will say the dongle is there but like it's just such a silly step the idea I mean it's why Apple has you know that the ultra-thin macbooks to right where you can also attach a dongle to it and it's that I that it's I I still understand it the idea of we're going to trim be like this itty bitty amount of space off of a thing is already small at the sacrifice of just a really obvious feature um I mean I I know that's not why they say they're doing this like they have their own bizarre logic for why this is a necessary step uh but I I just doesn't track for me the idea of losing core features to remove the like tiniest fraction of additional space let's talk about their quote because I was traveling while this was all happening so I sort of picked up bits and bobs of it but as I understand it the quote that they go back to of ever moving the headphone jack is that it took courage is that an accurate um ah yeah i mean that's false what currently not that's not what the word means you could say bold yes i agree with both at courage iie courage implies that they are doing some like great thing for the betterment of our species and in it's certainly not that i mean i think it yet if you work at a company like apple or ever a company that is obviously driven by profits and driven by the success of their products and I imagine are pretty heavily focused tested at least in terms of the feature sets you could see how someone in that environment could do let's say 50 focus test where they say hey we're going to remove the headphone jack from your phone and every single person in the room is like don't do that that's an awful idea and they ignore it and that person is like wow we're being courageous by ignoring these 50 focus tests yeah that's a bad idea it will it's such a it's such a smug Silicon Valley thing yeah our Virgin version of like the most courageous they could possibly be is that because the assumption is that all of their customers are wrong yeah and that they're the courage comes from doing something the customer doesn't want which is like that I mean not the courage part but that is a fair line of thinking the customer doesn't always know what they want sure and it is your responsibility to give that to him I mean that's how we got you know a phone that doesn't have buttons on it yeah but the the the every idea every example that I can think of where they took something away from the customer it was very obvious what they were placing with it with yes be perceived as better like yeah I'm I really wanted you know buttons on my phone when i switch to an iphone i really enjoyed my sidekick that I could you know tap all of the the letters and to while i was texting at the same time it was immediately obvious to me that there were benefits to not having having you know the basic buttons and switches right and it's sort of on the same token I mean you look at the Lightning port so the Lightning port granted a lot of people were pissed off because it's like not a universal USB input but compared to what Apple was using before which was the wider like clicky weird charging thing it is better like you can plug it in any way you want like you don't have to like plug it in a certain way like USB so it was like at least you understood the trade-off and here I don't know what getting rid of the headphone jack gives me I honestly don't know do it reminds me of have you ever had this is very judgmental but have you ever been to like a friend's house who has like a really modernist design aesthetic that they've chosen to decorate with I'm happening like the first buer Cameron's dead how does that kind of place yeah kind of like that where it's like they have like chairs that are shaped like eggs but they're not terrible yeah and they only allow themselves to have like one bookshelf and it's like with like five books and at a certain point like the place ceases to be a place that you actually want to spend time in yeah that's kind of how I feel about the form over function thing it right where it's like yeah I get it like there's one less slot on the bottom of this thing it makes the design a little bit better for someone who like all they think about is design but the actual experience of using it becomes like a chore yeah and at that point you have to ask yourself like it's designed getting in the way of just normal people using this thing yeah okay so to wrap this Apple section up to prediction time ok we'll we'll the blowback be strong enough for Apple to reverse course next year and include a headphone jack I I don't think so I just don't think they're that sort of company you think like recovered yeah I definitely think they're too stubborn um i would say that like the Apple watch kind of shows that like yeah the the continual push on the Apple watch without I feel like really understanding what people's issues are with it uh kind of encapsulates apples willingness to go for retreat further into its own design philosophy rather than consider you know what people actually want yeah although they have admitted I mean it feels like they have sort of admitted failure with the Apple watch whereas with iphone obviously it's still success it's not as successful as he once was in terms of grow but it's still successful whereas the Apple watch like they took what was it two years to sort of reup it and even then I mean I think it's clear that they considered as a side piece it's not like a primary device yeah I also do wonder if so they're all these rumors about the iphone 8 already right I'm for next year yeah I will see if that is what actually happens I mean I would skip an S phase I guess yeah but there's this feels like an S phase i think is the point that everyone has is like this feels like a stopgap phase right now and the eight is supposed to be you know a pretty significant leap it is how the rumors make it sound and I kind of wonder if the reason that we're seeing the absence of the headphone now is trying to get that out of the way oh yeah and then it's like next time it'll back well yeah there's no headphone jack we're used to that yeah and she was like all of these great features and there's not as much bad blood when that when that leap comes around yeah um I mean that to me seems logical considering you know they're playing such a long long game the in terms of how they introduce features for their hardware that it's the only explanation I can think of why they decided to do it this time around they should just have the camera I sing to you I think as a guy's it makes your photos so beautiful perfect pitch alright well that's pretty much wraps of Apple I'm not planning on going nuts on it it sounds like Chris you are not either I like my headphones my old timey headphones another big event that happened no joke an hour after Apple ended was this Sony event that happened in New York City announcing what had longed for a while bin the neo the PlayStation neo and now we know it as the playstation 4 pro so it's enough it's it's kind of a weird device and i don't think it's quite what people were expecting what was your take on it Chris um I feel like I might have been like out of the loop on expectations because this feels like kind of exactly crazy with me like I I didn't expect it to be announced that it would be available this year yeah that was for us the basic gist is there's a slimmer normal xbox or thank course i'm a horrible playstation 4 and that's just gonna retain the normal ps4 branding and there's ps4 pro and it has more power uh but all the details are pretty vague in terms of what that power does Leo it some games will look better on your on a traditional 1080p HDTV but how they'll look better is unclear in it doesn't sound like we can expect it to improve things like frame rate but there might be like better maybe anti-aliasing or better textures they're not really telling us what it means and it seems like it might be up to each game developer yeah that's that was my impression as well they like punted it two games overs yeah and then games will be in 4k but I don't know what necessarily how it true that is or like what their definition of 4k is because to running game at 4k on like a mid to high-end gaming PC is tough like I'm deaf you'll have to have a pretty solid set up so there's I guess it sounds like they might have a solution for oppressing 24 yeah that's that's my impressionist yeah like how you up res a DVD or blu-ray for your 4k TV it's not actually a native 4k output right um in which case that's neat but like what does that really look like and what does that look like compared to native 4k you have a 4k TV right I do yeah and how much 4k content is there on the planet not much to say the least um so if you have 4k right now I mean this is I think the big selling point for it and white could actually do well if you have a 4k TV right now you have to basically turn to a 4k blu-ray player UHD blu-ray which is expensive the blu-rays themselves are expensive the cheapest option for ultra HD blu-ray player is ironically an xbox one s ah and the new playstation poor pro doesn't play those discs right the other option you have if you have a fast enough internet connection is Netflix and Amazon and there's like a slew of kind of like weird streaming apps that are kind of trying to get on that bandwagon and that's assuming you have the connection to support 4k streaming not only that but it's assuming that you have the right Netflix and Amazon abs so not every netflix and amazon app is going to load 4k content oh wow and there's also like no good way to like force the apps to show that content so for example with me I've tried to get it to show up on my pc and it's unclear if that works like the traditional these are our 4k things don't automatically appear sure and it doesn't work with my old xbox one or Playstation 4 so my only solution is to use the apps inside of my samsung tv and then feed audio from my family might be got a receiver yeah so it would a mess it is it really is a mess and having in theory a box that plugs into your TV that like will guarantee that the things that are streaming are going to be able to load 4k yeah deal you'll need they are literally releasing either updates or new apps so that Netflix and Amazon on the ps4 Pro will show that they had to do a kind of similar thing with Xbox one s so complicated but but here is like again the big thing it's so difficult to really make use of your 4k TV that I think just being able to like go out in stores and say hey you have a 4k TV you probably have not used it for 4k right like there are pretty good odds actually that that a portion of the audience is not using the 4k TV to you know its fullest potential here is a device that gives you a showpiece a century to like when people come over and be like oh look this is what 4k looks like the to make question that I have though is like it's kind of weirdly what PS VR could do for VR is is it going to be a bad first impression right oh PS VR is I actually I don't think for if you've never used VR before I think p SVR is a good certifiable but if you've used oculus or whatever it looks much more basic yeah i think p SVR is fine I I do wonder though if like up rezzed 4k on a game that itself I'm not sure of like they were always 1080p in the past like it's just so bizarre and it's so pedantic and so hike it's just getting so tech-heavy yeah inspec heavy I mean it's hilarious to me that we were promised 1080p last generation essentially didn't get it sure and now we can't even guarantee 1080p on the original iteration of xbox one and ps4 on every game right and suddenly like somebody's coming at me like yep 4k gaming it's like yo yeah well they're not going to be like hey remember what we promised NEP no no it's really coming now yeah I guess not a really a selling point they've been doing so well and i'm not sure getting out in front of everybody and promising something that isn't that has like so many asterisks next to you is like the smartest move yeah but you know i'll say for me so you know i have a good pc good gaming pc and but i do play a lot of games that come out on pc on ps4 simply because the way you know I've got a living room and a couch and I want to show on my couch and obviously I could plug in my computer to my TV use not the way things are set up so i play games like deus ex which just came out on ps4 and it clearly struggles to run on ps4 like this certain like city scenes that like the ps4 chugs with and there is something appealing to say like for games like that you know or like a dishonored or like a battlefield that like you're not going to go from 30 frames a second to 60 frames a second but run a game pretty competently and smoothly um he's pretty appealing to me I just don't know how consistent that's gonna be honestly like I don't know how many developers are gonna offer that sort of support yeah and in the you like the weird thing for me is they've been saying again it's so hard to tell like what is true right now but that some of the stuff I've read is that if you have if you play ps4 games on ps4 pro they'll run smoother but they won't run better and I don't like let me explain that like what I mean is if a ps4 normal game shoots for 30 frames per second yeah but doesn't always hit it on ps4 pro in theory it should like be locked on 30 exactly you're not going to like it's not gonna it'll basically lock there so even though it might have the extra power to shoot for you know say 45 or 60 frames per second they want to have some general parity with what's available on the ps4 yeah what you guys a multiplayer game for multi-part you need that like you can't have call of duty being 30 frames on one console and 60 on another sure but this is like it's silly when you think about PC gaming where if you have the extra power you throw it whatever you want wait mr. its it basically feels like we're getting closer and closer to pc gaming without the options ah yeah yeah it feels right it feels like you know it's still this walled off garden which obviously has benefits in so far as like you know pc gaming can be a minefield of getting everything working and updating and video drivers or whatever you have to deal with and it's gotten much better over the years but still like most people that want to play games do not want to spend 15 minutes troubleshooting what just happened which you know consoles sort of fill that gap but it is not like I guess I was expecting from the ps4 pro I was expecting much more of a comparable system to what Microsoft seems to be offering which is to say like their it sounds like they're going to throw a ton of hardware at the problem and speaking of someone that is has been pretty unhappy with what Microsoft has done this generation at least this feels like a noticeably different product of what they're offering right now whereas the ps4 pro really it doesn't even seem like a half step like it seems almost like a quarter step to whatever their next-generation console is yeah i I'm I'm really reluctant to like say much about project Scorpio though yeah considering we know next to nothing sure about what it will actually look like yes and like other than them being like well ps4 pro has four teraflops and we have six yeah no I do I'm right yeah until until I see what it actually does that is better than ps4 pro I am kind of skeptical I think the the big advantage they have is they're gonna have what six months before they have to show the project Skorpion Scorpio yes right so like they have a lot of time to like start making decisions i'm not a lot of time but it feels like they have enough time to say hey we need to add one or two things that give us a real competitive advantage yeah what is available here although obviously the concern is they run into the same issue they have with launch on the Xbox which is to say like so the PS were pros selling at four hundred dollars if Microsoft comes out at five six eight hundred hours what does that mean and like does that sink them I think it is a huge issue for them if they come out again at a higher price point because people are just gonna be like I don't you know whatever I don't need all these flops I have a job well in any other thing is it's where things get calm complicated with it being essentially the same games on all these systems but with better graphics yeah is yeah how many people are just gonna be like yeah I guess it looks better like yeah I'm okay with what I already have I I'm those people i think are on you see right now right yeah are really like obsessed with graphics I I think have a place for that I don't and all these Xbox games are coming to pc like that's a marketing point for them it's like all these Xbox one exclusives are coming to pcs day and date yeah I feel like the thing I keep waiting for Microsoft to do with project Scorpio or whatever they do next is not connect but something that makes that experience unique right like what is there what is their camera essentially for the smartphone for you know the iphone like every year apple update its camera showing everything on your iPhone is totally fine and you can everybody can enjoy all their apps you know maybe they'll run a little bit better on one but 99% of this stuff is gonna run pretty similarly similarly across like the three most recent iPhones do but for people who really want that camera like there's a reason to buy the phone every year and that's what I'm curious about with project Scorpio is like why do I by this system if I have a good pc or on the flip side I'm like okay just having pretty serviceable graphics on xbox one or xbox one is ya know i think it's a it's going to be a tough sell for them and I think you know I think there are people you know hardcore gaming folks honestly like like me that like wants to have steady performance on ps4 and forty dollars you know is cheaper than I was expecting it to be so I don't know that I'm gonna get one at launch but but it is sort of appealing and I'm sort of in wait and see mode with with Scorpio then I do want to mention that we were talking about improvements you were just saying improvements that Microsoft can make year-over-year I wanted to talk about one such improvement that recently came to the xbox one but has obviously been on PCs for a little while I guess since Windows 10 and her name is Cortana the halo robot hello halo robot um Cortana is a voice interpretation AI I guess that takes orders similar Siri and Amazon's Alexa and I never used her on windows because why would i but it recently came to xbox one and I use the xbox as a media box so i actually use voice controls pretty frequently I've used them since launch they are not great but I was kind of hoping that Cortana would sort of right the ship there now before i would say connect voice controls worked maybe fifty percent of the time if things were things were ideal cortana seems to work sixty percent at a time nice but that's nice she takes about 15 seconds to get my video to stop and it's nice it's literally this is this is the interaction i have so i'm watching netflix i say hey Cortana stop and then she thinks about it for a while and then she makes a tea then she comes back just like did you mean snap and then she snaps and I want to throw my xbox out the window like it is like xbox they've made some good improvements that dashboard since launch Cortana is in an awful state that never ever ever should have come to the forefront do you like it do you think maybe that is like the wait is this on xbox one or xbox one s it's on both oh it's low on both I don't know if it's slow on both but my interpretation is that it's not that it's count because it's all like calculating in the cloud so it's a it's a network connection thing it has nothing to do with this the system power and that's the big issue is that my interpretation is that every single thing that you say to Cortana has to go to the cloud before it can come back and be interpreted whereas the logic would say hey here are these 60 words that people use on the regs maybe throw them into the hardware memory maybe you don't need to go to the cloud to figure out if they said play or not yeah and instead they're so tied into this idea of cloud computing or whatever the hell that they've totally hamstrung a feature that I use all the time I mean it's like it's honestly like removing the headphone jack like why have you done this to me it has not benefited me in any way shape or form I'm just impressed that you're still talking to your xbox it's it's laziness generally I mean it's it's the remote is out of reach and I'm willing to yell at it instead of reaching for the remote but at this point I can't even do that so your collectors still plugged in romantically well it is I know it's shocking um I don't know but it's it's just there for the mic I don't we say like they should just show as sold like a USB mic attachment for people that want to do that it's not an option now me well you can just I guess plug in a headphone into the controller and do it that way but yeah they find your controller God yeah things are in a very weird state with with I think both of the console manufacturers oh there's a third one isn't there does this another company may cuttle no well so here is I think this could be an opportunity for Nintendo I completely agree totally I think all of this like it's so complex so headache-inducing anytime if somebody asked me to figure out how HDR works really literally my eyes glaze over and I just want to boot goombahs let oh my goodness what if I told you there were two formats and they only worked on certain TVs he was never really sure if they were even working like have you ever tried to watch something wait jet you have 4k no okay I'm too far from my TV so I think visually recognize the difference degree in 4k and not but I did I looked at that chart which was like I'm whatever seven feet away from my TV and it's too much like I wouldn't be able to see it that's HDR I feel like was built for when people like you walk into the showroom yeah be like well what if I told you you could have like a jillion more colors and I'm color one so it's like sorry whoa oh my gosh um yeah I do feel like Nintendo has has a real shot here between its sudden renaissance of popularity on mobile phones and just the simplicity of the NX I mean we don't know how simple yeah it probably is we can assume that it's not going to have like three different models for you to choose from yeah um i don't know i think my crackpot theory I there's people have always been asking for the net flat netbox the netflix of nintendo games right but you can sure have simply the dreamcast era right yeah yeah like everything from nintendo and it'd be great you should practice sega put it all into this system and you pay a fee a month but i judging from how much attention the nes classic edition edition has got which if you have seen this it's a tiny recreation of the original nes with 60 i think games pre-loaded on to it yeah it's it's we talked about a little bit on the show it's definitely I think could be a huge huge holiday gift yeah I know Nintendo loves reselling classic games to you over Wi-Fi or over your internet connection ah but my my fantasy for I guess in X would be that it comes with a hundred games on it like that like you you you get this and you know hey hey everyone who now has kids that grew up on the NES here is to start introduce your family to the joy of Nintendo like that yeah the whole angle and then here is a system that you can have in your home you can take on you on the go and cheer all these games to start with and then on top of it like here's the new mario that you're going to write by um it just feels like it's such an advantage they have just so many old games that they could stack on and there's still be more games for you to buy yeah um that I I just would they be willing to rid themselves of that potential source though is the question I completely agree that's up from a business model standpoint super super smart especially if they have trouble with stocking the that the mini micro Nintendo like this seems like you know another alternative but I Nintendo has so like held on to that arcane method of like reselling you old nes game for fifteen bucks a pop that I don't know we'll see yeah and I eager to find out yeah I I just feel like they have to come up with some better solution for their classic titles like whether it be that or it be the netflix thing I just don't think they can for the umpteenth time resale people you know a 30 year old game for 10 or 15 bucks yeah and this would be a great way to like fix that problem because I do think a lot of people if if they don't find a way to transfer your games from the wii and wii u to this new system yeah like I I will be upset if they try to get me to pay for super mario three yet again exactly or super metroid which I fee like I you know bought on board countless yeah countless systems yeah it's ridiculous okay well I wanted to wrap the show talking a little bit about football okay I was flying home on a red-eye last night I landed at 6am this morning and I'm very sleepy but while I was waiting for my flight last night I was watching the the football match last night between the Carolina Panthers and the I forget the Denver Broncos name is our denver by the orange gentleman shah the Denver Broncos and I saw you tweeted about this it was a moment very late in the game when Cam Newton their star quarterback was given a concussion in front of the America Marika's like eyes it was horrifying like this shot that he took to the head and I mean you watched football I do fantasy football you do fantasy football how long can you sort of do this before it just gets so terrifying yeah so I have to tell you I I tweeted something what was most people I enough it was what was most offensive to me I think them the NFL just not caring at all about this man who clearly looks concussed trying to still play for another minute yeah pretty disturbing but also what happened on that play was he took this uh how much a helmet shot right at his head they didn't call it helmet to helmet and there had been he got an intentional grounding on it probably because he was getting hit in the head by another man's helmet it was the part it was a personal foul isn't it yeah that the two fouls equaled out right over the offset so basically what the NFL's logic was this man only 10 is next snapped in half and that is equal to penalty wise him intentionally grounding the football again which could have been a result of him not knowing where he was anymore um yeah that that seems especially silly but yeah I tweeted that and immediately it got retweeted by like some mmm area editor like bleacher report and it was like oh somebody got hurt in sports what we do like of course there are still people in the world who like a person gets seriously injured and it's like well that's the expectation they get paid millions we should if they die it's their own fault like it's such an ugly attitude that like I'm surprised is still so pervasive towards athletes it like also yeah I feel like MMA is interesting because you don't hear a lot about this stuff and must be because the fights I guess they're so short that like I don't know that there's like a lot or I guess the sport is much newer so they don't have a lot of a history of potential long-term damage whereas boxing obviously does and football dies yeah i think there's also an attitude sometimes across like everything in a modern am American culture if something owns up to something it's somehow okay would be like like um Donald Trump like if you say it's like well he's just a straight talker you know like if if Hillary Clinton or any politician basically before him said something racist yeah like lose their minds sure but because he like basically it's like yeah I mean this is just who I am pivot I like well I mean what could we expect of course of course how does that apply to the NFL though what I'm saying no I was talking about MMA I think like people are okay with MMA because it's like well I mean it's always always been a blood sport like yeah what respect like it's totally okay and i think the rear the troubled the NFL is going through is in the 90s like in the NFL blitz era it like kind of seemed to take a pride Oh a hundred percent you're like oh man this but this thing is not a nice as the seriousness of the injuries and guess is you know kind of taking center stage the NFL has had to kind of pivot away from just leaning into it yeah and really now it doesn't really know how to handle itself well it's funny because I watch hard knocks on HBO and hard knocks if you've not seen it it's like a really great documentary series about following a single team during their preseason and I say great but I also fully realize that like hard knocks is very very intentionally does not delve into a lot like the concussion stuff o'donovan to anything complex I mean they'll die they'll show like a guy tore his ACL or something like that but in terms of like long-term you know damage your yeah it's it's very surface it's not like a super but it does i would say morse more so than any other thing that i've watched it does humanize the players on these teams and it's ironic because it is designed to humanize the players and make you more excited to watch them play football but in truth all it does is make me more horrified when they get horribly injured on the field yeah yeah no I I do think you're right in that it uses the power of reality TV to make you feel an affection for really the sport in general yeah like what I loved is this year they they followed the los angeles rams who I despise as an idea because they moved yeah well not because they move but this the whole idea of user boy over here yeah using using a team to leverage your city to pay for stadiums is like grotesque yeah and real and they are I think like the beacon of all of that behavior and then FL and then you watch this show and you're like oh yeah I mean I hate I hate what they represent and I know they're like a team that somehow is also kind of the NFL's team because that stadium is going to be used for like special NFL things that are a separate from the own team which creates this weird conflict of interest for me of like cool it's a standalone team but the NFL also used it's like space for its own stuff that's what here to see flake gate to plug not even a conspiracy because it's just the NFL there's like yeah this is what we'll do is exactly let's talk about there is like we own it no problems here um and yet yeah you watch the show and then you're like oh yeah I could release you myself this guy has a lot of tank tops yeah okay what she really knows how to keep these guys together yeah it's it's tough mental gymnastics that I have to go through every year and and it looks like I'm still going through it so I'm certainly not out of the blame field if I wanted to swage myself I would have to quit watching football and I really like watching football so make the helmets better that's what I'm that's all I'm gonna say and that fixes everything chris is there anything else you wanted to touch on before we wrap things up no I mean I think that's it nothing's coming to mind do you have weekend no I really don't is there anything that you'd like to plug as a member of the verge sure the verge calm okay there's a technology and culture website for the modern age you can also i have a podcast okay it's called what's it's on all of your favorite podcast catchers and it's short that's why I recommend it each is there well is there an episode of the podcast that you'd recommend for people to start with um okay so each week we cover like just one topic and they're like 15 to 20-minute nuggets and there's an episode about fanfiction that I think is a pretty pretty tasty there's an episode on daxing which i think is really informative and any of our space episodes like if it's like Oh alien life or space colonization or rockets all those episodes we have my friend and colleague Lauren crush on it and ninety-five percent of them just end up being conversations about Nick Cage film knowing which if you haven't seen one little odd numbers uh yes kind of plane so plain the end of the movie there's a terrible plane crash the end of the movie I'm gonna spoil it for everybody so thank you turn it off dude if you're worried about spoilers the end of the movie is Nick Cage can sense that bad things are about to happen and all leads to like these like these numbers are the clue and it leads to just like the end of the list and the end is the apocalypse and she actually doesn't get off planet Earth and the entire planet is engulfed in flames and everybody dies except for a few children including I believe like his his friends children or his children and they get taken away by aliens except when we see them like post Earth's termination sure they're on another planet and it's clearly the Garden of Eden and the aliens look like angels so also believe that it's a prequel to our lives exactly this is that that God and angels are actually this alien race and every time earth begins to like its timer expires we get like a few of us are airlifted out and we're even by a different weight plan and the implication is at the we need to bang um I mean I am not the person who said that that was you said that but I mean you show me that God is making that leap like well let's just stick a bunch of children in this garden and hope that Scott space aliens are twins let's yeah but God is that the he's the chief of them right I mean well God alien I'll let you be you know the Space Jockey geology and yellow June the allergen shore ah yeah yeah anyway that's my plot the knowing and chris plante what's tech thank you very much Chris for joining us and thank you so much at home for joining us for this very special non Jeff episode of the 404 high-tech low growl etc we will be back next week with another mystery guest since Jeff is still gone and I haven't booked it yet so get excited for that it could really be anyone it could be Barack Obama can be good me I don't know Tim Cook could be here defending the iphone head had jack thing who knows anyway we'll be back next week thanks again for listening adios you