Gadgetory

good morning on Wednesday March 8th episode 191 of the 359 podcast my name is Rockwell and I always feel like somebody's watchin me and I'm here with Alfred Inge and Roger Chang in the scene at New York studios good morning guys morning good morning how long were you planning that for about 30 seconds okay worth it oh yeah very very relevant today I want to contribute something to the show uh as I'm sure everyone's heard WikiLeaks was out with the huge data dump disclosing basically how the CIA is hacked into our personal lives over the last couple of years now we don't know if the data is actually verified Cena hasn't verified it we can't tell there's been if it's true or altered although experts from our sister sites CBS News say that you know it looks it looks pretty credible okay WikiLeaks has a pretty good track record but we'll be talking about that we'll be talking about this brewing battle in DC over what ISPs can do with our data and lastly the sort of the the last bit of drama between Amazon and federal authorities over some data that was sorry data that was stored in an echo related to a murder trials so it's all about privacy today if you have any questions as usual leave them the comment section Brian we'll take out the best and we will get to them in about 3 minutes and 59 seconds all right hang on everybody we'll be back shortly here we go for the recording of the podcast in three two welcome to 359 we talk about the top tech news of the day you know they have the crap you want to throw it I'm Rutger Chen I'm Alfred Inge it's all about privacy today or the lack thereof first off is the CIA spy on us according to a WikiLeaks data dump the agency could be listening in on us using our very own phones the report which seen it hasn't been able to verify so the CIA is able to hack into iOS Windows Android Linux to basically look at use our devices to listen in on us Alfred how freaked out are you um very I don't think I'm personally being spied on but I think there's a lot of privacy issues at hand here especially considering that people have been turning to alternatives like whatsapp or signal to get encrypted messages yeah so that you know they can't be there's no level reassurance when you were on whatsapp and online and you could turn on the end-to-end encryption yeah it turns out that's not the case yeah well in this case they're looking at the messages before they're even encrypted so it has nothing to do with you know right corruption when you have control the operating system you can actually see what you see on the screen you could record the typing the gestures and basically get all that information a little little freaky CIA obviously has not commented on this but this is this is a huge blow this is all true this is a huge blow to the CIA and their intelligence gathering there's no issue right especially considering that this is according to WikiLeaks at least this is only one percent of what they have discover ight there they're gradually releasing more and more information which is kind of their operating system there where basically we're gonna slowly leak this out because they've been trying to build a discussion and debate on this they did say that they also have access to the actual exploits themselves you know the programming yeah owning behind that and you found out that some of those exploits had some curious names right yes so if you look at the Android exploits on their page about eight of the 23 exploits there are named after Pokemon there's they're everywhere Starmie spero lugia Totodile got a hack them all yeah I mean they had other ones that were named after a villain or a character and Doctor Who weeping angel okay yes figure that out yeah all right all right next up our very own Maggie Reardon has a breakdown of the battle in DC over your online data there she sees hip cause and some regulations that would forced ISPs to disclose how they're collecting data and what they're doing with it whether they're sharing with third parties opponents to this say the the the rules are a little too they're a little too strict and actually put them at a disadvantage to say Google or Netflix or Facebook which actually are able to use the data in a to share with advertisers so I don't know it seems like the FCC is kind of rolling back a lot of the things that they had been putting in place over the last few years right well they hadn't put the rules in place yet it was kind of a suggestion for from the previous FCC chair yeah but now a gpause basically saying we're not even they were supposed to go in effect but yes yes with a with a G PI the new chairman he is definitely more of a pro-business approach he sort of hit pause on that alright lastly the fight between Amazon the authorities over data that might have been stored in an echo related to a murder trial ended in an anticlimactic fashion Amazon and in a pen handing over that data since the defendant consented to the disclosure it would have set up a battle similar to Apple versus FBI epic but again we're get the way another another time another case for a precedent I think it's disappointing that the defendant decided to do that only because I did want to see what the legal ramifications were I think everyone I think I'm don't want to see it I mean we we talked about it's a year after Apple versus FBI and we still really don't have any kind of firm ground on you know who has it right away whether Wells Technology whether it's our personal privacy versus the government's right to look into our data well yeah the case for the recordings wasn't even on firm ground to begin with they were just kind of hoping that you know the echo was accidentally activated because that's the only time it even records anything no it's great point for more on these stories check us out on SEANET I'm Rob Chen I'm Alfred Aang thanks for listening and I love this first question I have in the chat actually not a question it's a comment from a CEO he says I guess it's good that some of us have a Luddite tendencies and don't use those newfangled apps I only use text Google Hangouts and sometimes Facebook well if you're on a smartphone yeah yeah texts are vulnerable - guys I got it let's all get 33 tens that's what I'm saying I I think this whole CIA leak was just a you know big mark only problem is that 3310 won't work in the US so we'll have to feel better I'll have to find another burner phone well know it like literally will not work in the US like it's just a prop basically but we'll have to find another burner phone you're crushing me with this I thought I had it all figured out what do you guys think is really gonna be the outcome of this like how are we actually going to see like a rollback in smart technology absolutely not no I don't think I think the majority of people don't care about their privacy that much to be honest well I think a majority people say they care like in surveys it's always high up there privacy is a very big concern but when it comes down to it when it's you know the choice between privacy and whether or not I can FaceTime or snapchat with my friend yeah they're gonna pick the snapchat I think I think this is America it doesn't matter about majority yeah I think I think the conveniency of it all has has people like like you said you know oh wait yeah I can I want to be able to snapchat and face on my friends at all time I remember being concerned about privacy myself and then I got an echo dot in my apartment right out the window yeah right now you really wish that yeah pretty much I have an iPhone so you know well and Apple is actually they made a comment yesterday they basically said that a lot of these vulnerabilities that were disclosed in the state of dump were patched up in the last version of iOS so Apple is actually recommended that if you haven't already upgrade to the latest version of iOS you will theoretically be protected although WikiLeaks forgot something well it's interesting I don't know who they're talking to in this case but there was a they replied to a BuzzFeed tweet about Apple announcing yeah that they had patched most of the vulnerabilities and all they wrote back was a no it doesn't and though they very much like fake news I don't know I don't know if they're saying that about Apple or BuzzFeed I'm gonna show my true colors here for a second and agree with Ryan and the chat who says I think it's funny that people thought that they were not being watched by the government yeah yeah that's a really good point especially always you're still surprised by this come on all these movies were you know all the high-tech spy gadgets that we see like I feel like people are a little bit conditioned to like to understand even like on a subconscious level or I'm I think that their phones are like can theoretically be used to spy on us like that this is not a this isn't a wildly unlikely scenario but yes yeah he's doing this right I think people are I don't also the where it's also not necessarily 100% criminal or Melissa Melissa know in a sense you're just part of the data part of the ether we're all just increasing the amount of data and this is getting just delving deep it is it is just scary because it's you know yeah you are being watched and it's a sense but it's not like somebody's sitting there waiting for you to you know yeah your most intimate moments I think it depends on who is using that data like if it's the CIA it's fine terrorism there's there's an argument to be made you know about that but who else has access to this and if I think it was part of the point that WikiLeaks was trying to make that you know the CIA had knowledge of what ton of these exploits these vulnerabilities and they didn't tell anybody yeah that's a problem because other hackers can find the same vulnerabilities it's not like this is something that only the CIA can exploit other people can exploit them to and now wouldn't change too many people's opinions if they had come right out in front Street and been like hey we're doing this right but it might have helped a little bit it might have actually made me naturally or they're supposed to be I think under Obama administration like there was supposed to be some mandate damn for the authorities to actually be a front and center and like to say well some of us they didn't but they did so some of that is maybe it's not malicious in terms of like actively trying or someone but it is malicious in terms of the potential consequences right the principal they're still at fault here they're still wrong in the way they executed this I'm sorry I cut you off yeah I mean I was to say I think people are aware that they CIA spies I think it's more so it just kind of hits home when something like what do you mean my TV can be like listened to or you know what do you mean right like oh now it can affect me personally so that I think that's like the issue that that Smart TV apparently there's so there was a camera on that TV and there's a remote with a microphone in it so yeah I mean like that's I mean I'm personally really ashamed of some of my Netflix habits but I don't anyway Don's got a deep philosophical question here says which is worse cable or phone carrier and busybody employees spying or government like black ops spying on you well one of them is making a profit off yeah I was City ISPs it's pretty for the silver lining here I mean that I mean that dovetails well that second topic that we discussed which speaking of I wanted to talk about this on the podcast but we didn't have enough time I hate the cable companies like argument about oh but Google and Facebook does it I don't think you know that should be basically I think if anything they should make it stricter for Google and Facebook yes easy free Campea so the FTC kind of governs Google and Facebook the other Internet companies the FCC governs the ISPs and so they they come in went in with stricter laws which yeah you're right like that's I see how their companies have a point there the counter-argument to the the whole like Google and Facebook are an advantage of weren't disadvantages for most people like you only have one maybe two options for your internet you know it's Verizon or it's the Cable guy's a Comcast or cable vision and with Internet services you can choose to not use them there are other services out that mean Crenna it's hard to get away from Facebook but you don't have you don't have to use them whereas if you want broadband which most people kind of define I was like it's an absolute must you don't have a lot of choices and therefore there should be some some regulations sure but their data there are certain people whose perspective is you know I don't opt into a lot of these programs systems technologies and are they 100% protected no is there an arguable defense that maybe they have a little bit or control sure right but at the end of the day let's get real it it politics government social norms people are spying on people it's that's the way it's been we've just made it easier by volunteering to put some of these things in our homes and pockets yeah yeah yeah no but I mean look we were the discussion was a little bit about whether or not companies can make money sure I think you brought in that the point of opt-in that I think is one of the big dissenting points is with the FTC rules Google and Facebook it's an opt-out model where's an opt sorry it's an opt yeah opt-out model where basically you're kind of enrolled in and if you want to get out you basically have to tell them you want to get out well and here's where the small print comes into play though how many people have actually ever read the disclosure agreement in iTunes yeah yeah so that's one of our problems is like so the thing of it is they what those regulations that were put on pause with the FCC they were gonna institute an opt-in model where you actively had to say yes I'm okay with sharing my data which I think should be it should be like that if we ask the board it shouldn't be it shouldn't just be the telcos or the cable companies should be everyone the opt-in should be sort of the default setting for everyone does anybody in the chat agree with that we want to hear your opinion it's agree or disagree yeah absolutely or somewhere in between yeah Aaron really while we're at it here's an interesting perspective from Australian Tigers how could they spy on us we around two point 1 billion using the internet I mean are they actually actively watching everyone in like a statistical sense or are they just trying to snoop out key words key moment I guess yeah my guess is red flags like you're on a terrorist watch list you probably touch your phone to be it's more fun it's more of a dragnet kind of thing because it's not an act I love that show I love that movie actually it's and I'm a other show with Dan Aykroyd and Tom Hanks yeah it's great it's it's not an active kind of thing though because with these exploits it's more like targeted yeah thanks yeah because it's not like yeah they've hacked every single yeah there's not like a massive database collecting all of our tables or yeah whatsapp chat message I think it is definitely more targeted yeah in this case at least have to hack into there's no like automated system yeah everyone I love to buy they just press the button and it is maybe like the next day to dump that's probably the CIA has one big red button it just pushes I love Tobias's feedback on this he says I think it sounds like a pretty boring job yeah yeah for the wires yeah yes I would agree I mean I think it's like you'd have to be like really into listening for juicy details like a minute of juicy details out of like 12 hours of boring discussions or just wandering in in this case bring back Jimmy Stewart from Hitchcock's rear window and is binocular in this case so it's not even listening because it's also good text message emails yeah it's probably even way down one could imagine one of my favorite scenes in the Simpsons movie is when the family's on the run yeah and they like reveal where they are on a phone call and then they cut to a scene with somebody in the NSA they're like I finally got somebody it's like a whole bunch of you yeah big room just listens always gets it first right that's true here's a question from Yahoo how can the webcam turn on without that little indicator light next to it so that's that's been less up for a lot of people's like that webcam is watch me but it doesn't have the indicator light on how does that we know how that works no I mean I mean that's a lotta that's that's a deep-diving conspiracy theory we're not adding any validation right but it's not without question I mean in that case though that that's only for your laptop there's no light that turns on on the front-facing camera on your phones right well for the end for the computer I mean if you've taken over the operating system the underlining foundation of the device you can probably tell it to keep the light as far turning on the cameras ways to go and like turn off the registry keys yeah exactly if you have like the keys of the whole operating system you can probably find a way and get around them think about what they did for the Samsung Smart TVs where they had the fake off mode right where it basically they left the microphone on and it made it look like your TV was off so there's ways to hack into these things to make it look like again once you have ashes that underlying operating system you can do a lot with that device yeah would use of a VPN mitigate potential spying activity no-no-no getting those back to the operon systems on your device anything you're doing on your advice they can spy on yeah buddy's saying if you're if you're trying to mask your literal location through VPN yeah would that actually deter I think they could still probably yeah power through that I think in that case yeah if we're talking about a brand but like in this case because that one of the exploits for Android that they used was that they could send your Geo tag and you know like where you were is that one of the Pokemon one I don't know but yeah that it could send your geo tag to the the CIA so it knew okay yeah Timothy Shaw I know dude Timothy says optin should be the default Hugh says just cut the cord I kind of let Hughes don't you just don't be so don't use the internet let's just all go move back into the forest moats and I like I get for him I will be safe please read my fave my cave carvings yeah if the CIA is hacking into you I guess what carry your pigeon yeah they could go pretty far that I couldn't make an international call did I depends so I can we get Cena to get behind like a new form of communication technology where we actually hear that a plated powered carrier pigeon carrier bird breeding and it works like a car lot like if you go in short distances like the eco-friendly one is the pigeon if you need to go long distances you buy you opt up you pay the premium for the hawk area pigeons are probably like more insecure than your phone though alright at this point I think the pigeons are smarter than the FBI sorry the federal bird investigation uh yeah who asks again if they are hacking is there way to know it like does it affect your internet speed they're streaming from the webcam like an impact we don't yeah that's a good question it's a great question I like all of a sudden your speed throught owes and you're like somebody's tapped right right right or like every time your phone has a go like a pause yeah it's busy for a second you have to wonder but I mean the idea though is like when you are hacking money is to leave leave it without a trace oh right if they're smart about it then they you wouldn't be able to tell ya the scarier part is like a lot of this stuff can work when you think your phone is off or yeah great mode in your pocket so you wouldn't even know if it was under control really most of the time it's probably being hacked while yeah as per usual Danny and the chat is my hero he says watch out for my stone tablet sale next week by a bundle get a free well there's like there's a guy who sells those no phones it's just a black 3d printed a slab of plastic yeah I have a whole bunch of them I'm mostly great stop it slow play snake mostly hate it cuz I didn't come up with it first but it's a great idea Stephen Stephens got a great idea it says as for the camera the LED manufacturers should design it into the circuitry so that the electron must pass the LED in order to reach the camera sure I feel for that I wonder how much done how would you feel like if you're looking down your webcam right down the right down the barrel and also nothing just lights up you're like oh no I can't like that just that may just be the Zuckerberg man just tape the camera or the Pope he does that too really yeah the photos are like a pope is smarter than me and I said that I did not have my camera tape I should I mean I want people to watch me let's see alright alright I think we're just about out of time that was the out of discussion thanks everybody yeah great questions guys thank you so many questions this week so all right that's a wrap yeah we got a bit of an abrupt ending but we gotta move on we're on our way over to we're done alright if you liked anything you saw or heard here check us out on CNET our podcast is available on iTunes tunas stitcher SoundCloud Feedburner and google play music we'll see y'all tomorrow later I you