Gadgetory

sweet hello and welcome to lobbies GDC sessions some special little podcast you put together because the game developers conference is on just a couple blocks away and as a bunch of really interesting developers and media people in town so we said why not get a few of them in here record some videos and also put them on the lobby podcast feed so if you listen to this thank you so much we got a bunch more he's coming and if you're watching make sure you subscribe because we got two or three more of these coming later in the week and I'm very happy to be starting this off with the man of the hour mr. Marchan Vince key congratulations you must be sick of winning Game of the Year awards the witcher 3 wild hunt wins yet another one jin dobrev atomic pies for battle saturday GQ podcast bungee po polsku switching is not cheap portugal yesterday avenger from australia yes I you know what is that yeah I I said that today's focus will be cool in Polish if you don't know if you don't speak polish don't not be a translation but seriously thank you very much for having me here today no thanks for coming in on such short notice as well all I can say is set a project red is that better is that it was that price right Zack that work we could work on it yeah to the projector setup right said the project set the project right oh it so avid add to the pro league all right all right yeah couple of drinks in me and myself okay okay congratulations on winning yet another award what did it feel like standing up there let's stop here for a while that's another award a game of the year the game developers choice here in the US it's it's really really very meaningful because um it's you know among the top developers well here and among the votes from the development community ah we are getting the game of the year so this is special this is not just another word and we are very very honored and very humbled and actually last night during the ceremony I'm not like it might not be us actually for a moment I thought yeah her story but there were no do so yeah they didn't get get that wrong last like it game over it's a good only five I mean you won you know we'll get to the sort of game of the the GDC Awards a second but you won Game of the Year a lot of places during a year award was quite hard to win game of the year I mean you had a metal gear solid game you to fall that game yeah you had rocket League which a lot of people were very very interested in that must make it feel even better right it's great yeah it's great I'm always at like being on that stage is considering had you been on that GDC stage before like not winning anything I mean which one obviously not and which its arm I don't remember I think we're not even nominated hmm so you've come a long way and definitely that's that's actually what I said during my speech that he in our case you had to make three games we had to make three games to two to get onto this dash and I was I was thinking about the leap between those the witcher 3 wild hunt and specifically with the witcher witcha to which is you what you've done something which i don't think many studios have managed to do which is you had this very you know focused role-playing game with a big fan base around it but you were still known as like oh they're like that cokie european studio who kind of like makes like this like really hardcore traditional Opie or PG but in the space of okay that's that's a good use point of view things yeah but but that's actually you're very right but look at your I mean your market now at America's huge like you've gone from dash it's number one market and right for us it's for the percent or even a little bit about forty percent of our business but which I'm guessing that wasn't with to write it definitely wasn't bunt up it's also it is partly due to the game and maybe the fact that when released the pc version the immersion curve what wasn't so smooth and I still remember one of the really saying when the editor who was a gamer named playing games every day that he died 50 times in the prologue so we probably it'll be too difficult look come on he should have played an easier path guys better but the the the fact I mean the sort of the main problem with going massive in the US was the could we r pc only right yeah so then it is really tough it probably 15 years earlier it would have been easier but getting into retail getting the appropriate budgets and i'm not talking about gigantic marketing spending but just just for people to notice the game it is really tough because I mean you guys sorry you guys might like it so you might write about it but still then the gamer is coming to the store yeah predominantly on gamestop more going to amazon or best buy and i don't see the game it's somewhere on the shelf and actually you know we're coming here for years and i know it was probably one of the most frustrating part on my job like doing the store checks and going to stories which are which are w okay it's over here very bottom we should have called it a Witcher it would have been a bit better but some uni us especially you need to go with with a proper budget and then in order to have this budget you have to go multi-platform right and you know i mean the the pc gaming it's it's great here but it's mostly digital so to make the game visible and to go up against the big guys so they don't know but as the release is here you'll be solved you have to be multi-platform and I think that was the main problem with the witch 22 in terms of visibility and massiveness particular here are in the US what was not really the case in Europe I mean you went eventually got witchetty on consoles as well yes but then again it was a year gap so you didn't have this sort of joint marketing budget the factory which III was first of all great game big game but I'm coming at the same time all three platforms so we could so really push it out there and then you know you are important game also if you look how how the retailer's look at it there's like a it's just a pc game yeah and then it's automatically differently on it's a multi-platform its is the big RPG and then again supposed to yeah exactly exactly people on the story tell people about it yeah i mean now we're at the stage where people you know presumably before would have been like oh I want to play a role playing game when they talk about like Skyrim's and things like that no you must go into a game stuff now and people say oh have you heard of witcher 3 wild hunt yeah that's uh i think you know the gamers do not realize it but it really it really takes a lot of effort to them to to get to a situation to a position where when you come to gamestop and say hey can you recommend me a good RPG game ends and they say that's the witcher guys believe me it's it's not easy and it's not cheap either yeah so but in those like four or five years or however long was you did end up turning what was like those get like what you too is a fantastic game and the people like I've reviewed well and people who played a really loved it but the Delta the gap between that and where you are now is he which I think I think you are you're very right in what you're saying and and then okay so one thing was making a great game and that's always the first and the utmost important thing like with that but then getting it out there and getting people to talk about it because the perception for example of the retail was hey let's look how well do which to salt and compare it to Skyrim okay that's a small cookie hardcore game from from somewhere in Europe from Russia Thank You Danny yeah that's from Russia somewhere around Russia you're about right by the way what is Russia I people call me Scottish all the time okay oh you're Scottish on st. Patrick's Day oh I know that but that uh but seriously so I'm sort of making sure that people commit to it and they want to put it out there in front of the store that that was also that was also quite challenging and and although we had I mean great support from our partner year Warner Brothers and and they have some muscle that's also very important and again it's probably not not the daily concern of gamers but thanks to it we are able to go wider and get more recognition and visibility and then more gamers because of that the game and power to a certain extent because of that the game got even more popular so it's like you know like a domino effect yeah yeah it's it's it's it's a domino effect so his legs were you surprised about how successful the was or how well-received it was yes really yes I mean you can never plan that you can never expect that and I don't think you should because mmm if you plan that something will be the best game in the world and you will sell all the most in the world I think you have an ego problem and so we always try to be humble as much as we can and humble I I don't mean humble not talking that our game is going to be great but we don't want to make assumptions yes will rule the world yeah and of course it's great in our industry because you show the bits and pieces so we took two guys like you and without your critical opinion and then we go to the to the trade shows be read BD three games government would not and these are the sort of early le metrics was the hype there did I like it I'm not sure if you if you remember that every time I did three we're handing you a questionnaire and that's right your opinion we're really analyzing all this all these votes very careful in seeing like they like this they don't like that maybe we should tweak something we should change something so it's a constant iteration but then comes the day one and and that's the moment of truth yeah and then you saw was that like four million copies in the first we saw so we sold six million copies in the first six weeks how much of that would do this very particular question but do you know how much of that was digital against retail like it totally depends on the territory in the US yeah and it depends on the time of the of the I mean in depends on on the on the precise moment because initially especial out of the core audience is getting digital here in the US so outside in the US was was probably initially sixty forty forty percent being digital so huge yeah digital went really well and from what we heard from the first parties because I mean pc mostly was digital obviously here in the US are was that we are one of the best cases and and I think when when gamers planned approaches these days they factor in a few things so if they want to keep the game they want to really own it and just play then trade it back they go for digital yeah if they think hey I'll just have some fun for a moment I'll traded back I don't get some money back they go for the for the retail so other people really wanted to honor which I think it also shows how strong the community is and I'm always very grateful that yeah were you talking about height before it definitely seemed from at least our perspective that the witcher 3 over the course of like a long period like three years was kind of like ramping wrapping wrapping wrapping and then going up you kind of seem to have the opposite problem with cyberpunk right we're like you barely said anything about it but people are like are you suggesting a different curve here but I people are like you've shown what one trailer right like one really good trailer yeah and I even feel like when nice trailer was shown people probably didn't register whose CD Projekt work for is now somebody sees up and say said that project I read and I go I The Witcher 3 people the right now even more right right now they see this trailer from a tough totally different angle just like yeah that's going to be real so thing I you know honestly speaking again I really want to be humble so right now we have the success of the witcher 3 people lava people played it and and it's even more responsibility and that's what we had we had a conference last week talking about our financial stuff and in our strategy and other mothers key said that you know its first of all I mean the fact that which were performed so well allows us to be even more ambitious with sabra punk but right now it sits on our shoulders to deliver here so yeah we were the next time you will hear about so everyone will show something and it must be great yeah what do you mean but like how can you say more ambitious than which here I mean which it was like a deca I was a hundred and thirty hours when I finished so which of which three was like a you know a tiny deal see you know even your DLCs are big it seems like know there are expansions no oh yeah sorry sorry les the DLCs are for free expansions would you pay for yeah if everyone can follow suit that'll be great I but what do you mean by bigger like what do you mean well I'm no no no no come on we have the staff here we're not talking about cyber back I'm not I'm not talking I'm not talking bigger it's I think people really expect something great and and that's what we have to stand up to and and deliver so that's so let's put a core gonna stop here and let's continue our very interesting conversation and last question and it's not really okie danny is a it's a studio excited about working on cyberpunk yeah they definitely are definitely big shift yes it must be exciting it is super exciting it is super exciting I don't forget you know that we're working on it for quite some time already so there's a lot of people where you know maybe I don't know drawing the the weapons or work in the medieval environment for years and suddenly you know guns and ammo yeah and mutants and implants that's cool excellent and you're excited about as well I'm excited along excited a lot and I'm just prepping my my Sarpong books collection and and and i have i have a solid plan of reading a lot of that like especially my favorites are so filled k dick right now i'm into the demand from the high castle because of the of the Amazon shells I I want to finish reading it before I start watching video but yeah then then it's the whole cyberpunk all over again excellent and while we're on the topic of putting corks in conversations you also mentioned I guess another project you might be working on as well did we yeah apparently yeah and then this project is a cork actually and we have to put this cork where his place is it are you releasing cuentas it's all because you said it's in a new genre as well ok the name of the project is project cork so let's cork it here Danny the ester things good it's really good you're better that's to have them is there how does it feel coming off this like big game you worked on for four or five years and then you're like because you're an independent studio and you know it's twas a 250 folks you have working it Warsaw uh-oh on the left side it's over 300 or in total the group is almost 500 is there a worried when you like say okay we've got you know bloodwine still doesn't finish then you've got like well bump presumably it's I close enough and then cyberpunk and then this other project is that is that as big as you want to go because like that seems like a lot I think um as long as we feel we can we can unleash our creativity and we have control over it I think we're good yeah and you will see when we've shot something so you will be the judge have you had people interested in like you guys have been incredibly successful and you're almost like very staunchly independent have you had like people try and come in and like yeah a queue of them yeah yeah the lining up in front of those honestly speaking what's that like that's normal I mean you know it's funny I I remember when we are in deep trouble it was probably 2008 was to running the distribution businesses there was a big economical slow down we have a crisis in European Union so we had to restructure and at that time mmm we're talking to a lot of possible investors really needed some capital to to finish off which to and then we structure our distribution businesses and those really nobody did want it to work with us we ultimately ended up with some entering this the stock exchange getting the funding and you know maintaining our independence but it was a hard lesson and I learned there really well that people are offering your money when you really do need it all right and we really don't need it on we don't want it we we will never looking for for anybody from outside to come and and enter ah the company with with with funding because we would have to give part of our independence away and you know what we're doing like for example we started the discussion talking about going the other key to retail and talking to them yes so we're talking directly to retailers of course you know we have a distribution partners all around the world but when we are hyping the game we're talking about the game we want to make sure that this is our energy this is our message and before one on which one when we had a publishing partner we couldn't do that and it was so frustrating and then what was delivered to the market was not really truly ours because I don't know we couldn't put this in the box or do that with the ball these are small things but they matter and you remember probably the letter yeah oh yeah yeah yes so sometimes things like that you cannot imagine that how hard it is to convince somebody else out there who thinks that this later doesn't make sense I'm not I don't want to go into details here but we had couple of discussions like that yeah so on that that's also part of the independence despite the fact that maybe they'll think hey which are three is too big just cut it in half and you'll make more money yeah or like why you're giving away 25 pieces of dlc free oh yeah oh yeah that's perfect example come on we can we can come up with a what a nice axle and what do you want two million dollars out of it I probably because we could make it 10 in axial problem yeah well what was caught on the other side of that sort of transaction now the dlc for the free DLC what was the the onus behind it was was a good will mostly yeah it was like respecting your fan base and what's it like on the other side of that transaction do you think the people do you think it gave more you know buying power to the consumer to buy this game like they felt like was a better deal or do you think they they felt like they were taken care of like is that something you do again like then how do you I thought that it was you respected me as a consumer is what I felt and I don't feel that way a lot thank you Dan thank you sir all right yeah but it's you know some people will not notice it rightfully feel like you do some people will maybe not trade their game back and some people don't maybe talk to their friends and tell them how cool it is when that that's all it is yeah um and I think that's great I had a I had a discussion mumph a month ago maybe with one of the publishers I have a good friend there and you know we have lunch and they say wow margin it was such a smart plan with this DLC see I said hey but it wasn't a plan it was only just I mean of course we had to plan the production but we just wanted to do this either it's a genuine move and so we think it's a cool standard we would like other people to do it but a lot of people started analyzing like also from a more financial product if that didn't make sense but if if they do something like that and even the motivation is that just like I don't know they'll put another 2% of of additional sales in the wreckage I'm good with that it's fine yeah just I would like to see more more more things like that happening I would like to see it in other games as well but if they do it if they do it for that reason they're sort of missing the point as well right because at the point wasn't about finances but maybe don't understand yeah one day and still gamers will get some free DLCs and it would be cool yeah it's kind of sad that that's like what you did was something so outside of what we used to write yeah that's i remember i think it was it was in your comment section and so release the statement so saying that they're free tlc's and one of the first comments was one guy hey they must have ripped it out from the game and right now they are giving it for free just for the sake of great PR and then i see some people talking about it and then somebody said man would why do you worry it's for free yeah and this close the discussion but was so beautiful so people are so suspicious not because there are suspicious by nature but because there were so many different and strange and maybe you know purely monetization oriented tricks performed on them in the past yeah that they are just hey somebody's giving something for free it smells it must be trick so no there was no tricking I think we've proven that way to do it you three the other thing that I feel like a lot of big publishers are doing at the moment as well as trying to create big online games where they suck people back in and again and again and then use that as a funnel to sell extra content I mean like destiny is a pretty good example of that you know but every game seems very Ubisoft have basically put online connectivity into every single game they make regardless of whether or not it should or not you guys don't deal in haughton fire it seems like anyway is it is that intentional is there any sort of do you feel like you know we do not do multiple projects we don't release very often so yes we're definitely interested in extending the the time gamers are spending in in our games and what do we do it with the online functionality or not we'll see us right now we did it with that and don't forget that ah is that this is the third installment of the series and this is the first time you're doing expansions all right yeah we haven't done before just because we didn't have resources for that so we're doing expansions our way and if one day we'll do online will do online our way it will be different do you think then like looking forward into you know if you're talking about cyberpunk and your your other projects is this the kind of the end for the witcher for a while and like one spot in line is I definitely definitely does that that's a closure and you know I was asked about it before they'll be with you for what not but I'm policing yeah we are we love the world with huge fans of sub-code skis writings but yeah if something will happen maybe somewhere down the line but we don't have any anything planned obviously speaking there is nothing we're working on right now I think we need to rest we spend the last word 14 years yes world with of it but right now is the cyberpunk time and and we have really to put everything we've got and then some yeah and deliver here it's a little bit sad to say goodbye to get all to know I was crying she's before the interview with you just just a little but it's like it's your it's your magnum opus right it's like you're standing on the GDC stage because okay okay so let's let's bring an example hmm you're watching your favorite TV series and so they tell you that it will land and it's ending and it's kaboom it's it's great ending its really anything and you understand that it's over and you accept it and you have a closure and it's great mmm so for me that's the preferred scenario and in contrary you have the TV series which goes on ya know and it's like you know spaghetti western going for 10 years and then at a certain time you drop out and you don't want to have anything to do with that and I think we've seen it with some games yes and Lee yeah yeah for I mean I have any call of duties are we deepen or Assassin's Creed you say the same thing as well so you guys are like is that's important to you too I guess have that really good IP that the eye thing stay strong even if you're not using it yes of course and and so maybe maybe we'll all come back maybe we'll tell some different stories at some point but right now really i think we with we've promised cyberpunk a long time ago and and right now is the time to do some work here did you think which your fans will play cyberpunk do you think Ida fantasy so definitely I definitely hope so yeah it's all about telling great stories and delivering great experiences yeah so I don't think people are like I'm only into fantasy RPG see if there's anything else I will never touch it that's like wow there's the cool game I mean a good balance yeah a good game will get people to play like I remember oblivion was a game that like there were friends of mine you only play first person shooters but because it was a good game like they never touched like that Toki and but like they were also like you know people who place currently probably don't play fallout yeah right on that point actually last week in your presentation you had a goal that was that CD Projekt would be one of the three biggest developers in the world are you there I'm not sure how is it how it was translated to English all right I'll say that the one of the best three best developers will be at all you I don't want to use the scale because it's meaningless what if we'll have a head count of ten thousand and then we sort of fulfill disco sorry yes I meant best in quality not not in terms of size do you think you're there I mean the awards would say you're there at least in 25 I I really think we have we have something more to prove house has this question before and we actually had internally a discussion who would think it's the role model for us and really when I look what rockster right achieved I'll out laughs asked to be there and having the witcher franchise it's definitely not enough to try that with her so I think let's let's wait and see for cyber punkin and then we'll judge I did are you more or less stressed now than you were like 10 years ago because you've gone I got decent bit of success and money in the bank and but you seem to still be setting these high goals for yourself like as a company hmm actually you know the level of stress 10 years ago which was was very different because quite often we were fighting for survival doing a lot of different things and then you know like done mm-hmm moving from the distribution business to the game's development I think that's where we want to be we know right now exactly what we want to do we want to develop amazing storytelling experiences and great games and deliver them directly to gamers so that's also juji is part of it and I think the worse at least for me it's when I struggled and I wasn't sure what we should be doing so I doing a lot of things and then you're working this you know 14 hour days and then you build something for a year or two and then half of it falls apart and then you restructure oh my god no no I love the place where we are today and well mmm well we are happy of course there is there is a lot of I don't want to call it stress I'll say maybe maybe self-inflicted play pressure right now but it but it's good that's that's what motivates us and that's what will never allow us to be lazy because I mean we are reaching high since the very beginning of the company and and and and right now we just have proves like these are words that you mentioned at the very beginning of our conversation that ah that we are on the right path mmm did those awards me a lot to the team back in Warsaw oh really you can't imagine what was Lee's please factor in that we don't we're coming from Poland is I don't want to say i don't want to sound it we have complexes or anything like that but in a way we have more to prove yeah because we're coming from a country where you know games development didn't have such a history wouldn't have access to all these tools resources so everything we're doing had to always be way more global and way more thought through reality an American company and American developer could release a game and if it was successful in the u.s. like yeah okay they're done and maybe you know five years down the line on the next game or or the third game in a row they would do some European localizations to this strange languages and I want I don't want to say that's the general thinking but I've seen a lot of cases like that but but the size of the market was automatically mmm making it easier for you to success just locally for pollen we would have never succeeded with which are one just in Poland so initially from the very beginning we said okay we want our games to be played all around the world and it was easier for us for you in Europe and then us came with the success in you guys came really commercial success with the witcher 3 so we're really happy with that and then like this makes people proud and yesterday so he could towards the game of the year and the best technical the technology and one of our guys actually one of the key programmer is huge he was uh picking it up and he's he said like she I couldn't believe I will be better than dice I don't yeah this is the this is real yeah people say our attack is better of course it's it's it's an award you cannot compare it these are different things but but that's that's very very personal yeah and all these awards are very personal especially after four or five years I'm probably I'm probably doing that that is not needed in this equation is I didn't know of the game you just got to sit back and do business relations yeah just let all that is some jokes about her story yeah until look confused in the back a shot at the game awards yet I am so speaking about your competitors are everything everyone else is out there if there was like another franchise that you of to do to like to make to like take over production on like only by somebody else or defunct what would it be I think and we had a lot of these discussions but I think we have just enough nor plate right now and so in a world that cyberpunk doesn't exist and the Wichita no no I'll not answer it it's what we do requires a hundred percent or actually two hundred percent commitment so we are not into buying and owning I piece just for the for the sake of buying and owning them we actually were approached by a lot of people with really cool I piece that we love to make a game but we said hey if we do something we have to have full creative control so we have to own the IP but again for the sake of full creative control yeah um so cyberpunk was was a choice from the heart and I think also it was good karma because we just had a great opportunity to acquire the rights but so I think we'll stop here for a while yeah do you think this will be like The Witcher another 14 years you want to build up grandeur yes exactly and you know i'll give you the exact these dates Oh 77 78 79 I mean I might be wrong by quarter or two but is it is that a scary proposition though to like take on something and then be like okay like you're clearly your your methodology the mentality you guys have is like we're going to do this properly we're going to take it seriously yeah we're going to do something big and it's a new IP so this new IP you need to get at the gate yeah and we're committed I'm going to commit it so we'll take as much time as needed and we want to make huge that's so that that's that there is more than what's on our mind and you know I I I do business i do in international development I talk to media I took to gamers some hour or hour phase in many many conversations and I represent the company so of course I had like hey this let's maybe acquire this or dad and we start discussing and and we all come to the same conclusion that if we invest into something and I'm talking about investing our time are we have to focus because we cannot do it right if will do even two or three things at the same time it's just not possible and and its really regardless of how many people you have on board it's a mentality it's a mentality a little bit look like a drugstore white right why there isn't a game every single year yeah there is a reason for that so you can have a different model beat I don't know the FIFA motorola call of duty assassin's creed model yeah but I don't think it's our model yeah and what how is it you're able to do that whereas companies like Ubisoft or Activision counts like what is it about your presumably you have shareholders that also wants to make sure you guys are turning a profit what is it about that that you know you guys aren't beholden to that is it just your mentality we're crazy yeah and we openly tell our investors in um I'm you if you have seen our our our mm conference hmm we took up a lot about values about philosophy and there is a reason for that and end of and the fact that we are quality obsessed and and it just we just want to send a very clear message to our investors that is not a short-term thing it's not like hey expect amazing results every single quarter and crazy growth we think that if we concentrate and focus and work really hard for for a longer period of time the effects will be there for them because they're also very important for us ah but it's not hit and run this is not like hey I'll making one hundred percent upside in just two years no you might not you might even lose some money but if you if you believe in what we believe in we shall if we show the same believe in the same values you will get a great return of your investment we have proven that with the witcher 3 so it is a very different thinking to the usual I'll see stock market thinking but I think it's right so we know that some investors will never invest in us and so and some investors will leave are we okay with that yeah and you're a pretty strong position there presumably as well coming off the back of that I hope so what was your favorite part of Waltons cuz you were kind of like I like you said you weren't developing it you're obviously like getting builds of it as it was getting made but when you finally sat down and played it what was your nose on your favorite part I mean I I actually I actually did all the question marks in every one of them yeah I mean prob I have a couple left in salyga but I'll out say everything about valent which is the bloody baron and bottling yeah but but actually so maybe I'll put it differently um what I love about rpgs are re sup quests and and and the freedom of exploration and one of my favorite games is obviously fallout 1 and 2 i love them i played him a lot and even recently I started playing fallout 1 for a moment keep a fallen for you know going forward one I have it I have it on my list but hmm good did this is the one difficulty I have that it is a gigantic time commitment and I know that if I start I won't be able to stop and yeah what is it about people making games to take 200 hours to complete nowadays asshole actually actually actually you're you're laughing but I have three kids and right and then I travel like crazy doing all the stuff for the company so I really have to play my gaming session right and sometimes you know if I'm able to play a couple hours a week it's a lot so in order to finish which 3 and finish it with all the question marks andand all the southwest I did it to my wife that i'll go for summer holidays with the family and from 7pm to whatever am time I can play and and actually this one I finished which I really yeah when did you finish it during the summer ok ty through so yeah yeah I what have you been playing that since then ah it fits into those little pockets of ties news i spend some time with darkest dungeon and I like this kind of I don't want to say old school because it's not all school but it's it's like a true to the bone RPG experience I may be a little bit to punishing for me yeah to my life yeah so that's been playing some fire emblem I just I just got the new one and yeah yeah about your 50s you said yeah I was my 50s because it's not that I burned through them little quick but when I'm annoyed with it um I'm a guy I'm not a collector yeah but people are always laughing that on my desk at work I have nothing because I other sell things I throw them away ah or I give them away i don't like to have to no good distributors yeah it's an even say so what did the S is if it was gathering dust because I didn't have anything to play yeah I was asking my friend to sell it on eBay so he solved three or four of them and I just got the fit because your fire emblem is up perfect yeah that so I'm wondering but when he will be selling this way once personally I'm losing a lot of money on each of them probably like eighty percent fair fight I did you play any of the other competitors last year them you didn't play fallout 4 you said did you babe metal gear solid rocket League I I'm not into the sporty games at all and so the last Metal Gear Solid was on the Gamecube over when snakes you buy yeah really yes yes that's the one I wasn't even made by kajiminda the next one yeah then the next one I have my lease is definitely fallout 4 but again it's like The Witcher factor it's it's it's a bit spooky it's like who 100 hours yeah margin do you have this time is Gary yeah definitely what I'm interested in the most in games like you know personally as a gamer it's it's I did RPG experience or the storytelling or I yuly both sometimes even more storytelling so I and the perfect model for me in terms of timing was the tell-tale model right okay I really enjoyed the walking that's the wolf among us and I'm looking forward to the next one I still haven't played they meet on miniseries right the reviews are like you know makes so wincing see ya excellent thank you so much marcin thank you very much come again really appreciate it at you've gotta talk on later today yeah it'll be open to GDC for all our values actually so alright I hope it will be interesting so he just spoiled it all on this no but you will release it later on won't you yeah let's go please sorry actually yeah I was just thinking was it Obama you gave the me of which attorney was our Prime Minister Prime Minister Prime Minister Donald Tusk app gave President Obama copy of witchetty the collectors edition and actually when they called us means your foreign affairs was trying to calling and the reception thought it was a joke so they actually contacted one of the big big newspapers that we were working with in Poland and asked him to get in touch with us yeah and we still that is it was a job but we gave them a version and then you know on the TV in the evening but but you know but it said that that's an old story but then before right before a 3-1 we showed the which would be for the first time was probably a week Obama was in Poland right so that was his second visit after the first one he got so pretty good timing i have to say and then so he's standing with prime minister to scan his stunning his dog thank you very much prime minister of reminding me again and la la la la and thank you for the gift I got in the widget to game which is a symbol of Polish innovation oh we're level yeah so tonight was amazing and then you know quotes all over you that's awesome yeah that's great so would you give President Trump a copy of Witcher 3 won't see that will see that if this will be the case let's let's let's worry next year you're not worried um you know what maybe we are we have some stuff going in Poland so you might be hearing you know say we are not we have we have our trump all right so actually a couple yeah I can appreciate that marchi Nowitzki thank you so much for coming it I give it's a pleasure thank you