Gadgetory

and good morning on Wednesday July 26 it's episode 257 of the 359 podcast with Ben Fox Ruben and Scotts time my name's Bibi G good morning everybody thank you for joining us guys hey good morning hey thanks for being here man this is great yeah so since Scott is such a brilliant brain when it comes to the mobile world we're gonna do an all mobile episode mostly talking about the Moto Z to force you were at the launch event yesterday and we'll also crack into the Samsung Galaxy Note 8 which we updated the preview on that and it's not expected until later next month bye Scott as you would accurately mentioned this is basically the start of the phone season so let's let's talk about that and if folks want to ask after the show about the iPhone aid or maybe the Google pixel to which we're also expecting definitely throw those questions in there Brian we'll get to as many as it can at the end of the show and yeah let's get started with the podcast and then we'll get to the questions after alright thanks everybody for hanging out sure thanks Danny Green shout out to Matthew dacher our good old friends it's so good to be back and here we go 3 2 welcome another 359 I'm Ben Fox Ruben and with me today is special guest Scott Stein our mobile reviewing maven hi hello it's really good to be on yeah phone season is about to get crazy and it's like starting in the summer so get ready nice well you are at the Moto z2 Force guy that's a mouthful at the event yesterday is this a phone that people should be paying attention to is this something you expect folks are gonna want to buy definitely well the Moto Z is a really good phone and you know not everybody is going to be in a mobile phone but this one has top-notch respects this has a Qualcomm Snapdragon t35 processor a nice display it's got the ability to attach mods it's really thin dual camera dual camera which is the new trend that's hitting all phones now basically so it's got dual camera they also debuted a 360 camera that attaches onto the back of that this newest mod that worked long yea with other but $300 which is expensive $300 just for the mod yes I'm not buying that I mean that's the problem twos we'll get into mods in a moment but as a phone's you don't need to get the mods it looks like a really good phone and you know it's about it's in that 700 to 800 range depending on carrier it's like that you know how much you're paying a month they said as low as $30 a month in the US the last year what's also nice is most importantly it has a shatter resistant display mine was there shatter shield tech last year that was on the Verizon exclusive force it's always hard to figure out which model of the Moto Z we're talking about but basically this is like kind of the best really like a sequel to the mo dizzy last year yeah and a Z this is this is like the one to buy as far as you're concerned and you got a chance to drop it a bunch of times which was pretty funny yeah they really set up drop stations they're just kind of drop on brick and you know I don't know dropped it a bunch of times and it seemed fine supposed to survive four to five foot drops however the case seemed to get a little bit scuffed so we're gonna do a bigger drop test on that I think the question you know the display may survive how much of the phone will look like crap when you're done with that though so so let's get to the aspect of mods we on the podcast have talked about the fact that mods were really hot like what was a year or two ago and it looked as if it was basically dying off by moto I mean like they they're leaning into it this is a second-generation phone for them is this something that you're gonna continue expecting to see or is it kind of the idea sunsetting a little it feels like it's sunsetting last year he had the LG g5 you had project ara which never materialized Google made then you had the debut of the Z which was the big one this year we have the Z continuing but moto is not expanded lenovo motorola they've not expanded that modularity to other phones you also have essential right which is also promising which they're declining to call it muds is ruben at a conference and he was like - not really mods there's something else right because they I guess Moto mod is the brand they stay away from that's true it is mods they're modular there is a difference however that essential is using it looks like a broadband near-field Wireless mmm-hmm which then it uses what they're saying is that that connection is all about power not about throughput on if you want to get technical on the essential month which we haven't even seen yet on though so it could suggest a network of things near you that can interact wirelessly whoo that is so that could be a next wave trend I feel like that could leapfrog mods if you get into stuff like the technology of Y gig which I've been obsessed with for a while soon as fast really taking on it's not really taking off but I feel like people need to kind of emphasize or I would say you know make the most of finesse what why get could do because then if you have something nearby then it could seamlessly interface potentially without having to be attached yeah at speeds that would be like you know USB 3 regions as if it's wired yes it's wired but that's a problem these specific mods II have a 360 camera you can snap on now there's a gamepad but what's the value of that versus one that does not need to be specific and proprietary that you could use with other phones that's a cool idea too there are other 360 cameras out there that you that don't have to be specific mods and as Josh Goldman reminded me of those costless and we haven't done tests comparing them that's my concern is like do you really need yet another camera they'll be your third camera on the back of the moto z2 so I also with the time we have left I also wanted to get to the Samsung Galaxy Note 8 we're expecting that launch event in New York August 23rd and Jessicka dual-core another one of our mobile reviewers updated our preview story about this what are your expectations for this phone you think it's going to be a big deal for Samsung hopefully they actually get the right foot forward this time it's a huge deal for them and it's also about image as far as what happened with the note 7 but also in terms of a you know product line that's always been the most boundary-pushing Samsung phone it's like their flagship for the future even more than the than the Galaxy S phones and so there's rumors about dual camera that wouldn't be surprising maybe like you're saying a speaker in the stylus we were discussing this earlier a speaker and the stylus which sounds I am your stylus it could translate as you write everything like flippy yeah a more annoying version of clipping that you can't get rid of Buon Giorno like your stylist talks to Italian stylist now so there could be reasons for for feedback however maybe to give like you know tell if you have reached an edge to give kind of a like not haptic but maybe sounds who knows Samsung I always got it has some wild ideas maybe pressure-sensitive display like 3d touch although if you have the stylus already I don't know if there's that much value to it then there's the question of Bixby mm-hmm Bixby Bixby's been because been a little little embattled so that is you know Samsung's a I also you know expanding into areas of computer vision to recognize objects through the camera kind of like google lens so that's a cool upcoming idea but again do you need an extra AI on your phone well your assistant yeah is it really gonna move phones I mean like that's the primary reason why they release these things is is it gonna convince people to buy Samsung versus something else I think most people really get annoyed by assistants at this point so like I don't want another assistant and knowing me on top of my assistant and something like which assistant is good at this point I feel like they're all kind of a series got a lot of problems Google assistant is like okay Alexis fine but it's not on phones that much at this point and you know anyway so that's nothing it's can't be good all right good I think we're well past three minutes and 59 seconds so let's call it a day on the podcast today but there are more to come many photos I mean many more to come if you want to read more about these stories check us out on Sina I'm Ben Fox Ruben I'm Scott Stein thanks for listening i Scott you are a wealth of information this is I feel like especially for like a phone show we could have gone for like eight hours they just flew out of me and I didn't expect it to it was great good Scott gets really excited about phones you never know when there's like phones I don't even like phone I don't care all right so on that wealth of information we do have some questions dhurpa purple asks great name by the way what about the speakers and this is in reference to the Moto Z - what about the speakers are they front-facing and how is the audio fidelity that's a really good question so we didn't get much of a chance to experience much sound and a crowded yet however we have a unit in the reviews in progress so more to come on that I will we'll check it out I would be concerned that the speakers aren't that great don't forget that the Moto Z phones they flaunt the idea that you can attach better speakers there's a JBL sound boost speaker which is really good if you're really into that if you want to pay more and that is that is that is my problem with the mods is that I think everyone wants it all on the phone and a lot of what Motorola's doing is like just pushing that off into yet another thing yeah the - totally had hit it on the nose I'm spending seven hundred eight hundred dollars on something and it comes with crappy speakers that I have to pay even more for yeah you could see why people might be a little bit put off by better speaker by another camera is that better zoom camera a 360 camera and dual cameras it would be great if I had a mod where you just attached a better phone on to it you'd be like oh you don't mean they're still fine that was a great what means they're still alfred was here for that he's a big fan all right we have some more commentary Jacob Kraft is talking about batteries he says I wonder if Motorola dropped the size of the forces battery to encourage the purchasing of battery mods it's a very good definitely noticed that this is a smaller weaker battery previous year yeah good spot interesting analysis on that 27 30 milliamps row up this first thing actually there's all my head still for the battery on the Moto Z to force 3000 milliamp for the Z to play so the batteries all took a dip the YouTube play got really good battery life on our test not as good as last year z2 force we don't know the motor claims still have really good battery life but yeah that is a thing there are so many damn battery packs that are being made as mods it's like 70% of the mods or battery packs watch yeah it went damn so many turn battery packs that's a very good point though I hadn't even thought about that before or maybe they just feel that we don't need to worry about this it's a smoke you can buy it's a small dip but people are so annoyed that they don't get enough out of their phone battery life that going backwards instead of forwards is obviously something that's going to annoy customers it is something that when we heard about it when we were first briefed we were not thrilled I don't think any tech person is thrilled with the back dip in battery that's not the dock being said okay with the smaller battery about how much less lifespan are you expected per charge like half an hour unclear right now I mean the claims anytime is a battery claim it's like I don't know we gotta we gotta test it but you know but the claim is that much like when the iPhone reduced its battery capacity one year in the iPhone 6s I think that there's like oh the battery life is still the same maybe it's more efficient processing etc but the fact is it's smaller capacity batteries so I ever 27:30 should be fine it's not like there's a small battery it's just not the force was all about like super power before you know and it was big it was a big phone um now they're going with the thin design it's really thin it's like the z2 I mean it's like this the original motive is better be like the z2 it is exactly it's like the Moto Z it is thin when you pick it up and you see it you'd be like oh wow this is thin also you want to put a back cover on it I think because the weird thing about the Z designs is they feel like something has been lopped off to me they have exposed gold pins on the back where it connects which was a mods yeah which always looks kind of raw and unfinished kind like oh did someone remove the cover to your laptop and there was a camera bump comes out but if you put a cover on the zphones the bump goes away so for a variety of reasons aesthetically I would like to put a cover back on which would add a bit of thickness again nice catch-22 if I can get met here for a second it's kind of fun too once again we love to shout out or loyalists and as well as our new friends and fans der Poel purple Matthew Yahoo they're noticing some of the the more technical things that have taken a bit of a step up and they're curious about the the improvements that I installed over the weekend Oh for real yeah so you can see my face now Matthew you know I'm not gonna yeah right I'm not gonna go in a tie right here but I have toyed with the idea of doing like a studio tour video for CNET just because we do have some kind of cool tech that's not the typical you know consumer tech going on here between our switchers and our mixers and our mics and cameras and if anyone's interested in that you know just leave a comment I'm it's not the kind of thing that's a super high on the to-do list but it could be fun even for just me to like kind of poke around and revisit our but yeah I said appreciate as a shout out to Brian we would not have a podcast without you and he's constantly upgrading our attack to make us look better so thank you I love that there's conversation in the chat right now going on about the Lego phone a proverbial Lego phone and I like that Matthew caught the reference he says would that look like the handheld admiral al head and quantum leap and now I can't get that out of my head a modular phone that looks like that multicolored brick like almost it looked a kind of Tetris II in a way project Aria had some like a goal to that yeah Oh God Lego really should make a phone mm-hmm I mean I just finished 18 hours putting together a robot 18 I feel like it was like 5000 the it probably was 18 altogether yeah that robot kit boost sorry yeah I just reviewed that if you should check out farting robots and all the other stuff that it can do but why not why not make a Lego phone for kids or for anyone right you wouldn't want to have like a monthly data plan attached to but it might be kind of fun to put it together and actually be able to like I don't know turn it into a walkie-talkie or something I had a Lego iPhone case at one point there was like an official one that you just had the the stubs that you know the little thing you can put figures on and you could build on the back ear your phone but it doesn't serve any technical no no but I mean think about it there is a market for you simplified phones kid phones Legos should get on that people love Lego these days these days they've been having quite a renaissance I heard this thing coming out it's called the Lego I feel like they went quiet for a couple of years and I would probably say over the last like three to five years like there's been Lego mania you say so some movies of hell okay good it's been non-stop since my childhood I know you're claiming yeah okay you may be right the movies were a brilliant move yes like now they're always like I just saw the Batman one a couple weeks ago and they have Ninjago which now all of a sudden they're able to boomerang that that humor into their own traditional franchises and things yeah now like suddenly you might get someone to care about Ninjago who wasn't a Ninjago person yeah Ninjago phone Nexo Knight phone I think we should start with the core first yeah I think that's going too far my son buys a lot he buys them we buy him a lot of Lego kids he has a credit card so I know a lot about this he's super in an X tonight's he's scanning all the all the shields into the app and alright okay bit of a detour under Lego we're getting a little low on time but Michael Brown shadow Michael Brown he says I think personal assistants need to become more ambient what do you guys think having to remember exactly what to say as a command is kind of annoying and yeah point but they're getting progressively smarter and it's sad they're in there in the clouds so they're getting better every single day and understanding context is very important Google assistant tends to do that better than some of the others but Amazon is certainly trying to do that as well so I think the trick will be and this is an interesting question about privacy to me about what happens with AI because a lot of times the companies will claim you won't really have much of a record of of all the things that consecutively or maybe we do but we don't knit them together but basically yeah I feel like AI needs to understand everything you've said going back a period of time so they can certain itting together understanding so if you start saying something like no that other thing or can't you tell me about what I just asked you or stuff you know stuff that's like a little more off the cuff I wanted to understand that because I feel like I'm always starting again right and let's go going back to Michael Browns point by the way I just remembered what I wanted to say as far as like I was talking to an Adobe analyst that said that in many ways when you talk to these voice assistants you need to learn how to speak voice I think that's what he was saying is that you almost have to speak in this technical code where you sometimes you even have to trigger like if I'm gonna use an IFTTT command I have to say trigger this you know to the specific voice assist then so there are these like different steps that go on and you know you you have to it's not it's not quite natural language it's not like you and I talking to each other do you know what it's exactly like it just occurs to me it's a lot like those old text adventure games yes it's like Zorich anyway they were text adventures and in order to look around a room it's like you know get the key on the table you couldn't just be like get the key on the table it's like look table oh there's a key right you're looking writing code basically yeah yeah left go left get key um that type of stuff go forward what is forward right like oh I don't know how to put the key away put key in pocket okay it's in your pocket it is this whole other like subversion language almost and I wonder if down the road this whole now they get to weird and philosophical here at the end of the show I wonder if it'll have any kind of adverse effects on our natural speaking it definitely will have it you think so yeah Brian and podcast hey Brian hey Brian doing Brian what's the day I'm having trouble connecting to the internet the good news though is is that all these companies and they're all the majors recognize this and they want to get us closer to natural language but the problem especially with what you were saying is natural language understanding is super duper difficult oh yeah actually like voice processing that's one thing natural language generation that's what they've been working on now the next steps are like natural language understanding and like it's very like computers are super literal and so it's really hard for them to understand what we say when we say it because they don't understand a lot of our context well and this is dialogue this is relationship building so at some point the deeper you get the more connected you're supposed to be in that opens up identities too because right now when you talk to an echo everyone's talking to the echo but at some point you need it to discern you versus your wife versus your kids at some point needs to understand your history sometimes a I like like Siri will remember you know I call my wife oh that yeah that's yeah that's Johanna like it'll keep certain bits for you is that me is that someone else talking to Siri like that's that distinction needs to happen more as well and that's gonna be immensely difficult right you can't go forward to understanding what's in your head and being able to pluck pieces out of there wherever a relationship happens I will tell you that these companies are very much having these conversations multi-user is already available with the Google home and I would expect it to be available at some point through the echo as well and you know you're hitting on a lot of stuff that's gonna make this stuff a lot better so I thought to go out on riffing on what you were just talking about it's got dirt purple says maybe they should give it something that makes it learn your habits and personality and I that's cool and that would increase the functionality and comfort zone with operating these devices but point do we get into how 9000 creepy territory where it knows you too well totally we get there we get there pretty fast thanks it's a balance yeah for sure it is that it is that perpetual balance and at what point do you start living your life to a routine to match the system so that is kind of what already happens in life that is kind of mind-blowing hey hey that's what I do everyday running to get to the train and coming into work yeah below that but but the functioning your life is writing the in the areas of your voice assistant sounds super creepy get ready for the for the continuing exploration of symbiotic mm-hmm that's exactly I do think that's the most interesting part is to what point is it evolved to a point are we evolving that goes back to how we speak and how we learn to speak it's gonna get weird but it has to change on both sides let's let's call it or else we're gonna be here all day but Scott thank you so much for coming and yeah let's wrap this thing up the podcast is available on iTunes TuneIn stitcher SoundCloud Google Play Music Feedburner and also on a little website called cnet.com thanks everybody for listening great questions everybody and we are back tweaking you out the rest of the day oh god it's really happening robot uprising don't be terrified don't stop be terrified while they scan your bracelets you could turn everything off alright so we're gonna be back on Monday by the way we're off tomorrow just a bunch of people are gonna be out of the office and we'll see you on Monday thanks everybody thanks everyone and be back you