Gadgetory

everyone welcome back to another ask GN episode as always it leave your questions in the comment section below and we also have a patreon version of this so it's a shorter bonus episode on patreon.com slash gamers nexus where we'll post that if you want to get access to that one or post in our discord where I can see your questions there too so for this week we have a few ones about cooling about overclocking Headroom where does money go for high-end motherboards so we'll talk about that before that this video is brought to you by our limited-edition foil anniversary shirt this shirt commemorates our ten-year anniversary design and is available in foil on a high quality cotton shirt completely custom designed for GN we're making a limited amount of these and then we'll never make them again so get your pre-order in now to ensure you get yours go to store like Aaron's Nexus net to grab the GN soil teardown anniversary shirt now just before getting to the first question as you saw hopefully and probably the ad before this section this is our new shirt it's a limited edition shirt it's kind of meta because it's it's a one-year anniversary of a 10 year anniversary shirt design so we're making a limited amount of these once they're sold that's it they're gone rot making more if you want to get one you can pre-order yours on store documents Nexus not net we're taking pre-orders just to figure out the size distribution so that we can order the right amount of each size and then it'll be a limited quantity once we figure that out so grab it there if you want to pick it up it is a silver foil print basically and looks pretty damn cool and also shiny for the teardown logo design first question is from spacejam flam who says why the sweet our cooler master AIO is so cheap what's the catch the catch is that they are not good so i several months ago tried to review one of these because of the reason you're asking they're cheap and the problem we had was it leaked and I think that's a pretty common problem so our leak was because there are there's like zero protection between where the screw for the fan goes in and a pipe in the radiator typically a CLC is designed in a way that see got a metal plate behind the screw so if a screw is too long it will hit the plate and no damage is caused or the fins are behind the screw have you been fins it's really completely irrelevant it's not gonna matter at the end of the day if you drive a screw in there though and it hits a water line that's a problem so what happened here I used the screws that coolermaster included but the tolerance between them was pretty large I don't remember exactly what it was but it was like nearly a millimeter or something and one of them was long enough to hit a water line and cause a rupture and leak all the fluid out so we never reviewed it and fortunately was able to save the test bench because it wasn't on but it's just the design fault you can work around it hopefully they fixed the problem by now it's been months so I would hope that the screws are tighter tolerances or just shorter rather than longer when there is a tolerance issue so maybe that problems fixed cooling wise they're also not impressive I don't know if there's enough interest maybe I'll buy another one and kind of demonstrate it but there's a reason they're cheap and that's part of it the leakage problem the other one being performance is really not that great like you're better off buying a decent air cooler for the same price then a low end liquid cooler and a lot of instances because low on liquid coolers the points of failure the extra point of failure is exaggerated just because like if you're spending 60 dollars on low end liquid versus high end air high end air that fan might die in like 17 years but the pump who knows what kind of problems you have with that including pump line next question is from frantic killer who says how much additional overclocked head room can we expect from a full model bla covering both the CPU and VRMs isn't even worth it hopefully you can do thermal tasking for comparison I'll send you a monoblock if you need it also thanks for the great content so when it comes to overclocking we did a pretty good content piece that answers this on the Asus Rampage 6 extreme and the problem with that board was the vrm had absolutely no way to dissipate all the heat that it was creating from a higher overclock especially with an 18 core CPU or 14 core CPU or something like that so when you're talking about vrm is really the the limiting is it thermal throttling is it hitting a point where protections are kicking in if it's not then really as long as the CPU is reasonably cool and the vrm is within spec there's not gonna be a huge difference in performance keeping the vrm colder to a point of say like 50 degrees Celsius as opposed to 90 it's not really gonna matter at the end of the day keeping it colder at say 90 or 70 or whatever versus 140 that matters because you might be tripping over thermal protect or over temperature protection at that point OTP or some other issues high current applications will strain VRMs that don't have a good cooling system on them already so the new motherboards rx-3 99 are looking a bit better some of the x-force 70 boards like that gigabyte one have proper finned heat sinks those do really well and don't even need the performance EVGA x2 99 dark has fans on it one of the the Asus zenith board has a fan on the BRM so you don't really need a monoblock in most cases just a fan will suffice but for purposes of fitting with your open-loop system you might as well go with it if you feel like it looks better and if you think it's gonna be easier or quieter than installing more fans near the vrm that's really the only thing but keeping of V rhymes not like a GPU if you keep a VM really cold it's not going to perform significantly better for your frequency then say like if you keep a GPU at 40 degrees versus 80 that'll make a big difference but the BRM does not behave the same way next also they can take a hell of a lot of heat as I said 150 is a common over temperature protection point and they start de-rating sort of 125 to 150 range for MOSFETs and for inductors capacitors are more limited but they also tend to not have the same thermal problem capacitors you might have five thousand hours of life at 105 degrees Celsius or something but they rarely reach that temperature unless it's really poorly designed next question is actually a really interesting one static albatross says where does money go on high-end motherboards it seems like high quality motherboards with good overclocking features tend to have a lot of non performance extras like I'm about two covers higher end audio Wi-Fi more RGB in all caps cetera how much do these features not have cost and consumer the RGB is the one I'm gonna focus on so I did have time to talk to some people in the industry who make motherboards and other components and the answer for RGB like let's say you have a really high end overclocking board by the time you're at the point of putting LEDs on it it's a couple bucks so a lot of the time you're talking five maybe ten dollars difference in reasonable MSRP impact unless it's a marketing thing where they can just mark it up a ton because they're the only vendor who does it or whatever that's not the case anymore so typically it's like five to ten bucks to add some LEDs if they're doing something like the digital RGB LEDs like the MSI lightning card that we saw at Computex 2017 then it starts costing a lot more because you need a ton of LEDs to get that effect to look good and that cost money so that cost more with the digital RGB LED light pipes and stuff like that but if it's just LEDs all over the board doesn't cost a whole lot so fortunately doesn't impact consumer price in theory very much like the bomb caught the bill of material cost is low and so unless they're marking it up like a thousand percent it shouldn't really impact a whole lot other features m dot 2 covers metal covers anything that's like shaped or tooled or anything like that that can cost a lot because tooling cost a lot just depends on how they make it if it's like injection molded if it's plastic or if it's if it literally requires a tool in like a punch or something like that some big machinery to make it those cost a lot more but all the stuff you're talking dollars from the most part Wi-Fi can cost a lot so Wireless is high single digits for pricing for most of the wireless cards that you see on motherboards these days low double digits in some instances things like certifications to have different vendor first party vendor logos on the board I won't specify but those can cost a lot too so a lot of your money goes towards the vrm for the most part and then if it's got a lot of metal on it that requires custom stamping or anything like that like the vrm heat sinks can cost a lot of money too just because it's a whole lot of metal so if they do some complex design with it that's where some of your money goes most what's the actual vrm though next question that quick shot gaming would the i-580 600k outperform the 7700 k and video editing 6 core 6 threads versus 4 cores 8 threads we have a video on Adobe Premiere performance with the 8700 K and thread Ripper and high end Intel CPUs our findings were that generally speaking a spec well this is specific to Adobe Premiere with Adobe Premiere you're better off with a high frequency lower core count device with an IGP than anything else and the video quality output is non-existent if you're uploading to YouTube especially so people who say but you rendered on a GPU it's gonna look worse no you were wrong for purposes of YouTube it compresses the hell out of stuff so much that it actually it's just invisible the differences if you could even tell them it has to be really high bitrate so that might be correct in some applications but not our specific application and for that reason using a lower end CPU with an IGP basically out reforms or performs equally to a lot of the h EDT stuff 8600 capers 7700 k whichever one clocks higher for Adobe Premiere is going to be better and then beyond and it's also negligible at that point especially because you should be CUDA accelerating anyway and then beyond that as long as the application is heavily multi-threaded then more threads will be better than not it just kind of depends on the application blender for example is pretty multi-threaded and we have benchmarks on blender for the 8600 cavers is the 7700 specifically if you want to see those results I don't have them off top my head next question is from Steam ed who said stt stream ed says in the future would it be possible to make the mouse oh the mousepad have black and blue colors no offence it looks great just too bright for a mousepad for me so this we kind of silently posted a new mousepad design that we have on the store haven't I guess this is the announcement of it but we'll do something more official later but we've got a white and blue mousepad design that we did and tracks very well looks great it is white and blue so if those colors don't work for you we're considering a black and blue option but let me know in the comments how interested you are in the one we've post-its on stored a game is a nexus net if you want to look at it it's not out yet that's why officially announced it or anything but take a look if you like it for the unique white and blue design awesome you can grab it there if you want the same design but black and blue let me know and then we do have other mousepad designs coming forward as well it's just it's a matter of obviously it takes time to make all this stuff but we are trying to make multiple designs to appeal to everyone next question the Phoenix I noticed that you and no other tech channels are talking about the stock prices and changes for NVIDIA Intel and the etc is there a reason of just not the category of your channel is okay so is this for a reason or just not the category of your channel I think it's what they meant to say I am qualified attack to talk about technology and hardware I'm not qualified to talk about stock prices in the stock market the two might have overlap for some people but we focus on the technology so we don't talk about stock prices unless I might mention it like in a news video but I'm not going to advise for or against purchasing stock because it's not my place in this machine there are other people who can do that next question is from Grimm 12 who says would it make sense in theory at least ignoring cost and efficiency to intentionally buy an overkill graphics card for a given performance level to minimize noise and heat output sort of if noise is a big problem then yes you spent more to get rid of it so something like the FT w3 ultra silent it's a fat card it has a really big thin stack on it and that anything with a large radiator or fin stack will dissipate the heat over wider surface area doesn't require the fans to spin up as early or for as high of an RPM and that will reduce your noise levels but you pay more because more metal and obviously it's the other problem here is when you get into like ultra silence like neurotic level of silence the issue is it's a low volume part so low volume parts cost more to make because they can't make as many of them so they don't get volume discounts so it can be worth it it's just how much do you really care about the noise because you can do stuff on your own to like just get better cooling in your case this is a problem with case design is there's a limit to how much you can stifle silence by just putting plastic walls in front of everything versus designing it with good airflow and running lower rpms which can address the same problem but either way if you get enough airflow into your case and you custom tune the fan profile on the video card assuming it's not a garbage cooler you can make up a lot of ground without having to buy the special fancy ultra silent cards it's just those make it easier if you want something out of the box they typically have fan profiles that are tuned lower as well so they don't get the same clock but they are quieter out of the box if you can do that tuning on your own I would advise that you do it as long as you get a baseline card that's not complete garbage because those exist too and then you should be fine and save a couple bucks as well Corwin says do you make use of a torque driver to standardize mounting pressures during thermal testing with there be much advantage of this when it comes to things like core Delta's we do use torque drivers for some stuff so like for example when we did that mounting pressure comparison i think with the vega cards where we had a mounting pressure paper that sort of color eise's as it receives force that's done with a torque driver to make sure that it's the same amount of force in the same spots every time the screw pattern we do is the same - for that specific testing anyway just to make sure that it's the same like corner to corner exact corner screws that were screwing in at the same time in the same order same amount of force all that stuff to standardize it for coolers yes but for the most part with coolers if you're just tightening to a point where it stops turning within reason that will do pretty much the same thing but we do have torque drivers I think there's one of the wall behind me somewhere for when we need those last question is from pyro CF he says for the average overclocker is there much benefit to increasing the cpu current capability past 100% I've not noticed it increased stability performance just just temperatures I'm guessing that non extreme overseas you're not going to be hitting a power limit we I don't know it depends on your board I guess but I hit power limits all the time or current limits all the time by not changing that setting so depends partly on the board and the CPU and how much you're overclocking but with an 8700 K for example or with even the Intel nook we were working on current limits are pretty easy to hit so if you're really overclocking I would advise uncapping the current limit or we're pushing it to a level you feel comfortable with because you will current throttle in scenarios that draw more current like for example Cinebench does a decent amount of amperage prime95 does a lot blender does a good amount so anything like that where you're pushing more current through an overclock then the motherboard will allow for you should on cap it but each motherboard is going to have a different OCP or current throttle territory for the CPU each CPU has different tolerances as well for where they sort of cut off the current versus versus whatever they think is reasonably said I don't know it depends on the board so some of the board's we work with have a 50 amp hard limit some of them with 8700 K is at 4.9 gigahertz I was hitting current limits so I would recommend uncapping it generally speaking performance is not going to be directly derived from a current limit aside from eliminating a throttle point that's really the only thing to be concerned about and that's it for this one as always you can post your questions below for the next episodes we'll probably do two of these for this week and we've got the patreon episode on patreon.com slash gamers Nexus you can also pick up this shirt before it's gone forever at store die cameras nexus net and support us again patreon.com thank you for watching I'll see you all next time