Gadgetory

hey everyone we are at PAX West and I am joined by a special guest Gordon ma on from PC where Aldi if you don't know who Gordon is Gordon's been in the industry a while maximum PC right for a long time plenty of others magazines I guess yeah oh man back when they still use paper yes and I have a lot of respect for the work Gordon's done in the industry and he's got some of the some of the best ethics in the industry so I wanted to bring Gordon on and talk about the r-tx watch or announcement as it were before that this video is brought to you by Lee Anne Lee is 11 dynamic a case largely designed by overclocker dare bower for high-performance water-cooling though our performance testing also Illustrated strong air cooling performance the 11 dynamic is affordable high build quality and offers a unique form factor case with dual PSU support by one now at the link in the description below so I where where do we start with this so I mean because it feels like it changes every hour because there's new leak benchmark saying it's faster than this or faster than that it definitely feels to me like they're sort of controlled leaks because nvidia is try to reclaim sort of the narrative on this card yeah which I honestly think no I'm gonna ask you Steve because you're the number one person like you are I looked it up in the internet like when you looked up RTX 2080 don't buy it it's got your picture I want to note though are we getting a little too far down the hate it's gone from people saying I want to know to people are cheering it feeling do you think that that's way too far yeah that's taking it wait like if you're cheering for failure of a hardware that's taking it way too far I think sure because if someone's cheering for failure of a component and it indicates that they have a bias somewhere else right which is either against the company they want failure of or for the other company and both of those that does make sense like the companies aren't your friends sure so yeah if anyone's cheering for failure I'd say that's taking a little too far right I mean I Eltham Utley this comes down to when you get the hardware in your hand Brad's gonna get ours we're gonna test cards is it gonna be worth it that's right that's when we should ultimately judge it right yes that is the bottom line yeah so I need your credit card because I need to preorder that now it's it's a bit pricey right it's a little up there there's a lot of discussion on that here okay here's my question no no I love playing devil's advocate that is a lot of people think those are my pins I have no opinion I'm a nihilist right I just if they come up with the twenty eighty and they said oh this is three times faster than a 1080 TI $1100 would people go like yeah or they'll be like yeah that's hard to say right I think it depends on the audience like it depends on who it is because if you're we were talking about this type of person who gets hyped about that kind of performance they have the lifestyle that can support it they don't care about the price and it's cool to be excited about it but you do have to obviously be responsible sure with what you're spending but everybody what I'm saying is everybody's like all right you're a choice is useless isn't that dumb is gimmick ever but if they'd said 3.5 x at 4k HD all right well that $100 then you're then you're talking numbers that people today understand people understand rasterization right and frame rate and yeah so if the response I think if if Nvidia marketed the frame rate angle with 4k or whatever it be something everyone understands a bit better so the response probably have been completely different but I don't think that's the right thing they should have done but that's no no this is them trying to to make that right or left turned away right I guess I wonder I just don't I so much of is about the price because people like I want I want ten atti performance at a 10 60 price right that's just right that just I what what do you think what would you if you were not in editorial land and you were a consumer what would you reasonably want to pay for one of those cards I would honestly I sort of wished that 2080 were a little more palatable maybe a hundred dollars less of these sort of I don't even know at the prices anyway because it's like it's 700 today it's 600 tomorrow I don't even know what it is but if it were 550 I'd feel a lot better yeah I would feel a lot less nervous so I mean definitely people are really nervous as hell right now and you know we were just in this panel and in Pedro forum PCMR was like yeah you know in fact they don't talk about performance it was very concerning right so people are very very constricted skepticism I think too because especially on our site because if you see that there's no discussion of performance I think the kind of the natural response is what are they hiding and it might be nothing oh yeah it could also be something so I guess the way marketing works of these companies you always assume that what you're getting is not the full picture and that there's something else to be discovered but that's not always the case obviously right so but on the ray tracing part so yeah we hear all the hate on the ray tracing I don't need it's a gimmick it's a gimme gimme gimme how does in video pivot to give us to bring us a ray tracing well still giving us a part that makes everybody happy with their current current library you're 99 percent of your library I okay so we've we've teleported because there's noise because we're at a convention so we were saying so we were saying before a whole bunch of Radeon fans ran us off the floor that came up with chases up yes get out yeah I have one beer so I'm making think of that so what we talked about we're talking about like how do you how does how does it do that how do you do it yeah how do you get raytrace and if that's really what we need right now right if that's if that's the next thing and we can't do much with with other graphics techniques until we get ray tracing how do you do that and solve the chicken or the egg problem of developers don't have the hardware so they can't make the games right and consumers don't have games so they don't want the hardware right all right I don't somebody has to go forward right somebody has to take that first time and that to me is like that's why I feel real like it's kind of unfortunate I'm a great racing dog but yeah at the same time am I gonna fund a game that's not gonna come up for hardware for games they don't really listicle II come out for three to four years yeah cuz I mean as a as a consumer if that's fully the case I would wait because what's the point of having it if you can't really use it right so it's kind of like buying a 4k TV back in the day when there's no 4k content right I got other than being cool I you know it's there's not a ton of point to it so yeah definitely that's that's a big challenge it's like though it's like the folks and we know them who went out and they bought 4k panels yeah four years ago right they've been sitting on these $2,500 4k panels for four years now you probably can run 4k Kanye and you can do it on a hundred and eighty dollars yeah that's probably actually better than that $2,500 4k it's a stiff I mean I understand that that's that's that's different it's too fast right yeah as long as they're still good performance just in normal shaders and rasterization I guess you can you can justify it and until we see performance numbers and run the test ourselves we obviously can't really you know make a firm they're not pretty buying it you're not pre-ordering it well lying I saw his order yeah got like three of them on oh that's right we bought all do that video just so he could buy so I could get them all I wanted them all for myself yes all right well I wouldn't be by as a consumer anyway whereas matter what card it is we were talking about this early and I just gotta ask who who's who goes out and just puts down a thousand dollars for something ain't even know what it is it really does that I've never that is a new thing to me I've been around PC enthusiasts for forever but pre-orders and stuff nice I don't know I think so first of all if you've pre-ordered it it's not personal you know we don't we don't we don't hate you but it is a good question though and I think a lot of it comes from like the the game developer culture where we've been pushed into pre-ordering games to get special treatment or something so people have gotten used to that right oh my god you're right you know those who buy r-tx 20/80 right news breaking news gamers Nexus can tell you this right now yes you preorder RTX 2080 two extra levels two extra levels that's a three anyway no I'm making that up yes two for wine get nothing so you get nothing you gotta have to pre-order this you get it first that's what you get but it is fair it is fair if you're rolling around a Ferrari who cares I'm buying this to make you feminine at and if I owned Ferrari I would buy the 2080 TI just two of them just to make you feel bad yeah there's nothing wrong with that because if I had a Ferrari who cares I don't care what you think right yeah other than that no never other than that general consumer our audience I I wouldn't it's not I know some people from Nvidia that mentioned this at their event to where they were sort of saying to me hey people are saying don't few order this and I felt bad about it but I don't know we don't it's not it's not just RT X it's just in general any hardware that you don't know anything about yeah why would you ever I wouldn't preorder an Intel or AMD CPU without any benchmarks either no so it's crazy but you know what I just heard I heard 1900 K it's gonna have soldering oh yeah I saw that yes and it looks like it's real this time so alright so I'm gonna I'm gonna bring this up if somebody has wondered for years because we hear one half what half the internet says no solder sucks paste is just as good in the forest you know some people and I have somewhat defended in telling this in the past you know they sort of know they you know it's a billion-dollar company multi-billion they know what they're doing yeah if they're saying that they can do this on pace then maybe it's okay now they're making us all look like fools right if they really do solder then they're like coming on saying yeah okay solder is better all right and you would tell an S the solder doesn't matter right yeah it's gonna crack or whatever so I I don't I don't know how to square that I mean it really does make me feel like an idiot well hey but I am an idiot most of them that's not true let's you do good work or no no keep keep your head in the game oh yeah I just don't I just don't get it cuz I I how do you square that if like if paste good but now solder better and you've been pace is good but III think I mean it comes down to they didn't need to use solder and now if you're trying to give into our stock is trying to get an extra hundred megahertz or whatever they might need that thermal Headroom right yeah it's true and it matters now because now they it's not just Intel versus Intel any all right yeah it's a really good point Steve because to get to to eight cores with this chip you need it all those cores eight core solder good it's gonna be hot 79 80 16 core space no right yeah it's a mass I don't know like I could understand like okay whatever a six core 87 through ka you're in the cheap seats you're not getting soldered we're gonna do the solder on the Xeon part but 79 80 X he was sorry no he's pissed yeah I know it really there's no way that in topi come back and say we did this because no I mean yeah there's it's it's very clear that it was never the case that actually paste is the best right I mean that's pretty obvious Intel's more or less indirectly admitting it by soldering the next CPU so yeah I don't know I don't know how to square that especially if you have a two thousand dollar 18 core CPU with yes with thermal paste on earth right yeah that was not really tenable to me like I was deleting 79 80 xes for other youtubers because they want to overclock it or use it you know in high-end applications and it should be soldered but this is just as good as solder I saw it I've been told is they it's why would they why would they do that well the arguments are that solder on a I think it was a smaller die cracks or something right but or micro fractures Saturday night at EDX C's pretty big died yes that's what I never and there's no solder on that I don't know I I don't I can't explain it I can't I can't I don't know what to say there it just what to do would you welcome the change moving the solder do you care you know I'm not one to deal in two thousand dollar CPUs and I'm not one profited D five hundred dollars GP because I like warranties hmm but I would hope I would expect that it is a premium part even though it's just in a paper box cardboard box that they would do the absolute best to make it better for end-user so I got to say I'm a little if really this eight core part comes out and it's it's soldered and it really just it's a complete about-face it's kind of disappointing I gotta say yes you know there's really no way to like to square that I I think it really does they should just come out say yeah yeah sorry sorry you got a spare for us cuz look we got 50 more dollars from the CPUs yeah yeah yeah that is a bad as it's gonna be a hard it's gonna be tough one to swallow yes I'll I'll be happy to see it I guess but definitely it's it leaves you a little bit a little bit skeptical of the reasoning we've heard for the past CPUs whereas like you're saying it looks like they could do it the whole time yes that's right if you if you can do the solder and they whatever 450 or 500 bucks but you can't do it on a $2,000 you it does make you wonder yeah what's up yeah I don't know so are you are you happy with the current industry trends then with we've got Intel pushing for maybe solder that looks good that's good we have Nvidia trying to do something new that's maybe good we all will see right how do you feel about the overall direction of the big three companies I gotta say overall it's wonderful a lot of ways thread Ripper got some weaknesses yeah but still awesomeness for 32 cores for that price Intel pushin eight core super high clock good part we don't know what they're gonna do with the 28 core part that comes out later but the least they're trying so all that competition is driving that price is awesome also Nvidia clearly trying to pivot is gonna make it I don't know should you do it I don't know find out and find out my the biggest weakness is AMD Radeon right yes really need a me just do something yeah yeah my concern is is aim D falling behind too much because we it's clear with the way companies actually getting these dominant positions you really want that competitor and it's got to be more than just the underdog at some point so yeah and the Navi has really gotta prove itself a bank but if it isn't a heavy rate racing part and md says hey look we can get you a 120 frames a second at 4k HDR right versus 1080 rate race 4k we're gonna be like going like this right what's your prediction on which way the consumers are gonna go do they want way more frame rates at high res or do they want really cool ray trees without a lot of of reeducation towards ray Tracy and I think right now would probably go towards frame rate because that's what everyone understands but we've seen these schisms before where you kind of get two paths and it's like frequency your core is there something like that so then just she's gone through before it's gone through with memory before and I don't know I don't know which way it would go I I would I I feel like it's gonna go rasterization but NVIDIA has a lot of marketing money so and they have a lot of MDF they can give the game developers and really get ray-tracing Rowling's so which isn't necessarily bad right right somebody's got to get the ray-tracing ball started yeah that's got to be fair but I heard you're already a pre-order navvies so that's that's I actually have one yeah yeah yeah yeah Roger gave it to me before he left yes took it out of the prototype lab you have to say don't tell any of us buy it I think right just buy it just fine just buy it so there you go Gordon telling you just buy it Debbie just Navi just just bite this button yeah I've already poured it I just put $500 in envelope and I wrote AMD I need to see the mail sit it off did the the mailman look pretty happy with this there was a way address like okay off to Santa thank you Andy all right well if you wanted to see more Gordon he's got a podcast that's pretty cool you're on it recently on the PC world channel on YouTube I believe and with PCWorld calm with the website look home yes so check them out there Gordon thank you for joining me for the time we'll see you all next time