Gadgetory

hey guys welcome to the third pocket nail pocket cast and we're happy to say that we are on itunes now hopefully the next step is that we will be on zune we've submitted our feed you'll be able to get onto that soon and you know download the pocket cast your zune or your windows phone 7 right now you can go get it on your iphone ipod touch ipad fill in the blank so today we have three people with us once again we've got Evan my permanent copilot here say hi Evan hey guys and and haven't and we've also got Adam Lane who actually has been with pocket now longer than any of us actually combined he's been here since the year 2000 or 2001 say hi Adam Oh Adam knows a lot about about phones and where you know we always benefit from his knowledge of especially Windows Phone he's been a windows phone user from the beginning using windows ce e devices when they couldn't even go on the internet so he has a really interesting perspective on on sort of the mobile industry which is great because there's a lot to talk about today especially in dealing with Nokia and the announcement that they are going to choose windows phone 7 as their primary smartphone operating system but first before we get into that Adam happens to be among the very small number of people in the world that have an HTC 7 pro that is like the you know the form factor like the touch pro 2 running Windows Phone 7 has the slide-out keyboard with the tilting screen how is the seven pro Adam that's pretty nice there's a lot of things to like about it but there's some cons to as well I really like the tilting screen how it automatically fills up that's something we haven't seen before right and it's got the touch pro 2 keyboard which is you know probably the best mobile keyboard ever made it is yeah it's it's slightly different the funds are not raised as much but they still feel pretty much the same so you get the the great deal to that keyboard a little bit less click too so I have a question so it seems that you can only get the screen in one position when you slide it out it's tilted up you can you tilt it and keep it flat no and it just tilts to one angle and that's what it is you can try to tilt it down but it's going to pop right back up I have a question too in that vein and windows mobile seven right now is mainly a portrait oriented OS so so how does that work when when you're flipping the keyboard adding a lot of screens that aren't meant to be turn yes that's one of the not-so-good things about this so most of the places where you're going to be inputting text will rotate to landscape but things like the home screen doesn't rotate and most of the hubs don't rotate and there's one place where it's really annoying it is if you're searching for a contact in the People Hub it does not rotate no yeah you're going to type a contact name with the keyboard slit out and landscape both but the layout is still in portrait mode which is really weird and annoying and I guess I you know we saw that Windows Phone 7 didn't rotate back a long time ago when we were testing the LG Panther I guess it doesn't make that much sense i mean if you were developing the software for windows phone 7 Adam what would you have the the home screen do when you slid out your keyboard I guess it doesn't make sense for it to go into for the whole screen of rotate yeah I'm not sure it's hard to hard to say you could either have it totally rearrange itself so that maybe there's four live tiles across the top row right but that'd be kind of weird with it it would be I don't the tiles just have their their contents rearranged you know but stay in the same place but have you know the next shift and the images shift and still have a landscape sliding from left to right so that's top to bottom right that won't really work on the longer horizontal lot of tiles what made you see how oh well maybe it's just the type rotated right that can you know that all the shapes would because that's the biggest problem you have is is getting these shapes to you know it's like a puzzle is getting them to fit you know nicely in both portrait and landscape in and we hope you know we see that problem widgets a lot on the Android is getting them to work properly when when there's a rotation involved so I think the best situation when you have you know very finite dumb shapes like this like squares and rectangles is to just leave them and and to have the contents of the boxes changed John character you know it would be more than changing just a text you have to change the imagery to but that's a cool group yeah so literally the tiles are staying in place I think what you're suggesting Evan but then just that the text literally rotates 90 degrees or whatever it might be right it would have to be a little bit more complicated than that some of them but that's basically what what just be I mean I don't think would be super hard to implement something like that one of the one of the advantages to Windows Phone 7 as I'm learning as i'm looking into app development for a pocket nail appt this year is that because it's so standardized across all these all these devices to make an app for Windows Phone 7 is so easy because you know the screen size you know that the home screen is not going to rotate and landscape there's one icon size it's just it's so much easier than Android where you have to have three dimensions for splash screens for icons and it's so it's I kind of I kind of like that about Windows Phone 7 that they kind of keep it locked down it makes it a lot easier to develop for hmm there were some people would disagree with you that's really very good so let's move on to the next thing really big news this week nokia held a press conference and not to the surprise of the mobile world they are putting windows phone 7 on future nokia devices they're kind of putting symbian and meego on the back burner those Toby creating phones with those I guess call them legacy operating systems now but their focus going forward will be windows phone 7 and we were trying to figure out if this is a if this is a better situation for Microsoft or a better situation for nokia what do you guys think I think it's absolutely I'm sorry to say something Adam oh well yes I'm sure I'll go first yeah I think it's a going to be probably a win-win situation for both but maybe slightly better for Mark stopped because if Nokia is helping with this you know ecosystems are developing a large worldwide ecosystem windows phone is going to benefit from that and anybody else who's building windows phones will also be able to tap into that new ecosystem what what is this new ecosystem to keep talking about for those that are unfamiliar well nokia is gonna help you know distribute the phones because they have have a really big worldwide presence right or they're also going to add to the mapping capabilities which you know bein is kind of not great at yeah you know terms of other countries so okay so Microsoft right now uses for their Maps application use bing maps do you know who whose map data that is I don't remember exactly was it tell Matt perhaps it's either navicat or come it's not navteq because nokia Owens navteq right okay and that's and that's what they're bringing forward so they're going to have navtex very robust mapping suite of software and presumably they'll be able to improve location-based services Stephen Elop talks a lot about lbs locations that I think that's telling out to come out I believe right don't know yeah telling that fur from bing and isn't that that's owned by tom tom it sounds right I may be wrong on that the nice thing about having podcast from the computers you can put stuff up so guys we keep talking and I'll check it out perfect yes so so I mean nokia that has a lot to offer Microsoft and Microsoft is kind of the saving grace for nokia because they are in a situation where they need software with an ecosystem as they like to say already built so they thought about android and they were talking about how they thought about android but they thought it would be a little bit too difficult to differentiate and they very crowded and dare we say fragmented market whereas windows phone 7 it's still new it's still fresh you've got a finite amount of players and they feel like they can make a difference and it seems like a win-win here i think it might be similar to what Motorola did cuz motorola was on their way out you know they're in pretty bad shape and then they went to android which was unproven at the time you know beginner and when they released their droid that basically put android out of that yeah they were they were running out of variations of the razor and and yeah you're right they they went with they went with Android as they're saving grace and they got in early too although earlier than nokia is getting in here i mean they they were the second if if i remember the second android phone after HTC's g1 it still took a year after the g one was released do it yeah yeah I see what you're saying so guys it's actually tella Atlas the tampons and that is a mapping data company yes but that's one of the big to tell Allison yeah I guess I'm very interesting and so the news today we've been following the Mobile World Congress news as our as our editors on his way to to Spain the the news was that Nokia hopes early some windows seven device this year which obviously we we knew before there wasn't really anything new in the press conference they were just talking about some of the reasons they went with Windows Phone 7 sort of what's going to happen to symbian and meego and that's pretty much it they didn't you know that we had we see these renders of engadget leaked these renders of pretty nice-looking nokia devices running Windows Phone 7 although they they kind of look just like an HTC mozart except the back as an interesting contoured design and they come in colors so that should be cool I mean how can nokia make Windows Phone 7 hardware better cat you know the camera is obviously more thing definitely the camera and but what else here screams they had that clear black technology that they are aliens nice screams got real life battery life they probably know a lot about battery life hmm and in general I mean nokia you know the hardware is generally pretty solidly constructed so i think we'll bring some new materials to the table of just you know that they're very good at design so I think you know even with some of the restrictions that that chassis one and then you know later chassis to will will have laid down I think Nokia will be able to work within those to come up with some some pretty cool some pretty cool phones but the question is you know are they going to be cool enough for for them to to have a wide penetration that that nokia has sort of enjoyed over the last few years and then condense a big question it looks like a don't be done and I think there's there's a lot of people that are angry than nokia gave up cindy and there's people that like Simeon rail you know they don't have to buy a feature phone in order to use you know the stripped down versions of whatever asked 60 that are going to stick around yeah well I'm not angry because I was not a fan of symbian and I think most Americans aren't a fan of symbian because we never really got the chance to use it but certainly Europeans I have known symbian very very well right I mean Europe just invested what was it 30 million dollars in the simian foundation to try to prop it up and now and now a okiya which was kind of the last corporate benefactor and it basically turned its back so I don't know I think there's going to be there's going to be some repercussions that that we haven't seen yet fair enough fair enough let's move on there's a lot of other mobile world congress news out today's sony ericsson announcing for devices that we knew about the Xperia Play or let's start with the xperia arc which we saw at CES super thin device running Gingerbread and then they had the experience lay which has been no secret it's the sliding device that has the PlayStation like controller or the ps1 like controller and then there's the xperia neo kind of a mid-range android 2.3 device and my phone is ringing curse our podcast Ibaka Casper is live and uncensored yeah I know that's why I'm not going to cut this part out so so the neo is kind of a mid-range android phone and then finally the Xperia Pro which we didn't expect to see at all it's i'm going to call just another slide down keyboard android phone and the keyboard doesn't look that juicy um i wouldn't say that we didn't expect to see it at all brandon because we sort of suspected that there was a keyboard version of the love the neo coming along and and that's kind of what this is so so we were definitely looking for something like this although although we weren't sure that it would come at the show yeah that's a good way of classifying it as a neo with a slide-out keyboard unfortunately it's using the the same old one gigahertz snapdragon single core cpu and even if they could be saying that you know the whole one gigahertz processor like you know one gigahertz ease and so last year no it really is in fact I mean we're starting to specify in our posts whether a phone as a single core or dual core processor because hey it's not dual core it's not cool but I maybe I mean as far as i know you're so all these new phones have single core processors even the xperia play which of course is a gaming handset should have a dual core processor but maybe sony ericsson realizes that hey you know android isn't ready for dual-core processors you know forget what motorola and LG and Samsung are doing we're going to stick with the single core until you know android you also have to do a little bit with pricing you know i'm sure that that a dual-core processor raises the price of the phone and they probably want to make the play more mainstream device yeah but you know yeah i know what you're saying it would seem that with a carrier subsidy it's going to verizon that they'd have some wiggle room to offer a more expensive device with the dual core processor and it's just pretty good i mean if it's a difference of you know 100 vs $150 that the you know for consumers those are two completely different price points what do you think what do you think the price is going to be on the experian play on verizon I think it will be hundred dollars on your contract 100 is the new 200 yeah I mean you know 18 he really said the vote pricing the inspire 4G quite aggressively and I think unless you have something to poor or you know a very fast cellular broadband LTE or hspa+ and you're not going to be able to charge that $200 anymore and certainly not not 250 air or 300 right right right yeah I mean it makes sense that they're sort of bumping down these single core devices to the 100-dollar level and anything thats dual core is going to start off at two hundred and and up from there as is the case with a thunderbolt which of these uh which of these Sony Ericsson phones do you find the most interesting Adam probably the Xperia Play yeah I've got to be a slide-out stuff there everything else is just or the same ok yeah basically I mean like like we mentioned the ark is going to be really sweet hardware it's going to have Sony's Sony Ericsson's you know you interface but of course you'll be a bit of rooted and put on something a little bit lighter by the way and maybe you can look into this Evan as you sit in front of the computer sony ericsson ericsson was around a very long time ago and i thought they were a small player making feature phones before the days of smartphones and then sony bought ericsson are merged with eric sexiness is still very completed its own company sony ericsson is a joint venture between the two companies so instead of making their own self of both sony ericsson have come together and you know and now we make cell phones together by Harrison still makes other products on its own don't they make a cell phone tower equipment and such yeah it's a lot of like a back haul stuff first off I think well there really a they're really coming through with a lot of great hardware I wouldn't be surprised if Sony found a way to cut off the Ericsson part because they're a very brand focused company and sony ericsson is definitely different than just sony ericsson brings a lot of a lot of that interesting stuff that that attracts europeans to the table i think each are you think Erikson's want to be the same you know without the arabs and info ryan right and then also today which is we're recording this on Sunday februari 13th the Samsung Galaxy 2 was launched at Mobile World Congress and again not many surprises here it's got a new version of the TouchWiz interface to allow for some really interesting ways you can reorganize the home screens it has a 4.3 inch wvga screen kind of disappointed here in a few way is that the screen resolution isn't the qhd that all these you know higher end phones are going to have 960 x 540 kind of disappointed that the the software isn't terribly changed from what we saw in the current generation galaxy s phones but it's nice that they're they're bumping the screen size it's going to have a dual core processor Samsung dual core processor 1080p video capture which is quite new and sort of the next cool thing in smartphones and it looks how do you guys think this thing looks I like it I'm sorry I don't know I looking looking good 9.2 millimeters thick super thin indeed which is going to be a pretty cool with such a large device it seems to have a big bezel on the top and the bottom so having that thinness will be pretty cool definitely thinner than the desire HD also remember that you know it's probably going to look a little bit different in America then then this version does as the as the other galaxy s variants did you know from the GT i9000 yeah it's gonna probably have some chrome on it make it look more like an iPhone yeah absolutely now something that's a little bit confusing the original samsung galaxy s that went to Europe I never actually got my hands on it so it has a menu button on the left it's got a d-pad in the center and a back button on the right I'm assuming and the the galaxy s2 has the same design I'm assuming pressing the center button will take you home that's always been my assumption that I had never actually tried it out they modified that in the US on you know off for carrier devices they change that they took away the d-pad they added four buttons instead of these two so it's just interesting to see that they're continuing that sort of d-pad design not sure many people use a d-pad these days hey what are they good take one if they could have the xperia play that has plenty of d-pad options so galaxy s2 this is a big deal and I'm really curious if they're going to get the penetration with this device that they did that they did with the the original Galaxy S getting it on all four carriers I'm going to say probably not because there are just so many other good options for carriers to latch onto I was agreeing to say anything well bouncy ass was a huge hit so why wouldn't the carrier want to want to get the sequel and this is a way how to phone you know I think it at least in terms of design you know they really they had a homer here it's just really tight and this and this phone relates very closely to the infuse which we were trying to figure out where do you think how do you think these two devices are going to sort of coexist Evan well we heard that the galaxy s2 isn't going to be coming out until dude oh that's just a rumor so you know they're there could be a like you know a couple months between infuse and you know if the galaxy s2 comes out in Europe and doing they're not come out in America or for a couple months off of that so there may be a good amount of time between the two phones you know being on on ATT for instance what were the specs on the infuse it had a bigger screen and what else but only a single core processor idle swipe your ears yeah the one point two gigahertz Samsung chips so that's that's kind of interesting curious to see how the galaxy s2 and the infused benchmark differently because you've got faster a faster single core in the Indian fuse and then of course dual-core 1 gigahertz in the galaxy s2 but 4.5 inches still takes the cake as the biggest non tablet smartphone so i'd imagine scary but argue with that yeah I don't the dell streak is too big to be a phone i think a lot of people would disagree with that that's just when I think you can hold it up to your face and talk to talk with their right you can I mean it is a phone have you ever seen a dell streak in person me oh no have you Adam Oh best buy they have them on display it's huge and I mean if you're putting this thing in your pocket then you've got really big pockets and it's it is it's not comfortable as a phone and you look like a moron holding it up to your face because it has a very thick bezel and it's not just a 5-inch screen it's a 5-inch screen and a very thick bezel so knowing that I think that ATT could position the infuse is sort of the the mega big screened phone and then they come around with the galaxy s2 a few months later saying kind of like the infuse but you know smaller screen faster processor newer software sure sure that could be it so that is the galaxy s2 let's move on from here we'll talk about some things a lot of other announcements happened in the in the last week something I want to talk about was the kyocera echo Adam and I were in New York to see you know David Blaine perform a crazy a crazy stunt Adam did you figure out how he did that yet no but think i read somewhere that he can hold his breath for like 17 minutes it's a world record Wow so let me just let me just explain what happened for people that didn't know so we're at the at the sprint event New York City in the sort of ballroom type thing and David Blaine comes out in a tank full of water and he stays in there for about 10 or 12 minutes and doesn't come up so you know he's presumably holding his breath if he's truly underwater and what he's doing he's opening his mouth and fish are swimming out he's opening a book and fish are swimming all around him he lights up a cigar underwater it's obviously fake but it looked kind of cool uh what else was he was checking his phone what else was he doing in there Adam already poured a glass of wine he put just kind of floating around in the water yeah yeah food sitting at a desk yeah he's wearing us wearing a suit sitting at a desk then he goes away and then the president of kyocera comes on the stage dan hesse from sprint come on stage and then it's always so funny how they try to connect what happened with the entertainment with what they're going to talk about and they were you know and they were like oh well David Blaine likes to do more you know multitask when things are difficult and the whole purpose of the dual screen design on the kyocera echo is to allow for what they call simulcasting which is a novel idea and curious to hear what Adam thinks about it I'm going to just quickly say that I think that if HTC were to do this phone the Tegra 2 processor a gigabyte of RAM to high-resolution displays and beautiful hardware and by the way kyocera didn't deliver any of what I just said it would it would be an awesome phone but kyocera they don't have really well any experience doing smartphones and there I think getting in uh what's the phrase there there in above their head maybe what do you think I'm high I agree mostly it's a really innovative idea and I'm not sure how exactly to work with all the apps it seems like only certain ones could appear in opposite screens did you get that feeling yeah that's definitely true well it's only a couple of the built-in apps will work in that in that manner where you can move stuff from from one screen to another or though you know work in collusion with each other and I think they said they will release an SDK but that this phone is going to be sort of you know I feel like a one-off and I don't think that and there's going to be enough interest in it for their trilogy developers we don't probably be some you know private developers people in you know little communities and forums but I don't think you'll see see a lot of major you know commercial software release for this yeah the SDK is a joke and no one's going to no one's going to use it except for as you imply kind of you know developers on the side you just want to mess around some clarifications on how the software works and I think this is one of the problems with the echo is that in order to understand how it works you have to listen to someone like me talk about it for two minutes as my understanding and this may be wrong is that any app can be shown alongside another app but if you want to get a special tablet like view they gave them you know the email is a perfect example where on one screen you get to see your message inbox and on the other screen you get to see an email preview those have to be created within the operating system they have to be coated from scratch but but the cool thing is that the native apps or the third party apps you could be playing a game on one screen while having your email up on another or you could have YouTube up while you're browsing the web and that stuff will actually sort of function in tandem I don't think I can play two games at the same time though yeah yeah there's some weird thing going on for hibernation apparently when you go to one app the other app will pause sort of because Android just doesn't have the capability to run two things at one time it's a single you know it's not like a windows or a Mac computer where you can literally do two things at one time but the the concept is just I love it I use multiple monitors I know Evan does to Adam do you have multiple monitors for your computer kind of but ones of TV's so it's just mirrored really all right well I mean at least you know the benefits so it's a tremendous productivity booster to be able to have email inbox on one screen and the web on another screen for example and the same thing is going to be the case with multi screen smartphones I mean it's just it's just such a great capability to be able to see more at one time without having to single task next we need one that folds out with for a little space for little screens yeah and another it'll it'll it'll have the battery life of a phone you find in your drawer from 20 years ago um it's so it was so funny though Adam remember the president kyocera or whoever whomever was demonstrating it said we know that battery is going to be a problem with this and we were both thinking oh so they come up with a new bat technology or some way to increase battery life and they said we're going to increase we're going to include a second battery and a second battery charger so that you can swap batteries in the middle of the day great solo better carry another thing to carry I mean I mean if you have to yeah it's it's it's nice if they did that but I mean this product is just becoming a little bit too too complex and and hopefully HTC notices how cool concept this is and they do something with it Sarah very complex it is it is I mean it must have taken them a really long time to do this in terms of the engineering all right so let's let's move on to let's see what day of the week was this when we're talking about the the veer and the pre three I think that was on Tuesday is that right I think about a birthday I think it may have been Wednesday to your right it was wednesday so really big news from palm this was sort of a palm well we can't call Paul many more if called HP this was HP's opportunity to show that their investment in in webos is going to pay off and it's interesting that so many people think that webos is a really fantastic platform it's just put on slow hardware with poor battery life and so they come out with the beer which is of course a microscopic tiny phone that is supposed to be sort of the successor to the pixi and then they have the pre three which finally bumps the screen resolution of webos so what do you what do you guys think about these did they it was this enough for them to do to show that webos can be a competitor I don't think so it seems like it's really just more the same not too much innovation there I see people want a new form factor I mean yeah the beer is a new form factor but if people want to see something like really sexy poem from HP pong you know on the lines of the galaxy s2 or the Xperia are for ya and I don't think they're showing that yeah you know yeah they bumped the resolution and and in the process or whatever but it's still basically you have the same phone i think i agree with you guys totally i think they spent a lot more time on the on the touch pad than they did on the beer and the pre three we're not going to talk much about the touch pad because we don't cover tablets but it's clear that they may be sort of minor changes to the hardware they they increase the screen size the resolution it's got a faster processor in terms of the pre three but they didn't they didn't really change the the software it's going to come out with I think web OS 2.1 is it 2.2 is that is that what it's shipping with ok so yeah and you know I I picked up a palm pre 2 recently just that just to have it around and I was looking her well as fi just because you're so into smartphones that that your your Bible not even a cover for the site or anything this just arrived yeah yeah gotta have some perspective and after coming from an android phone after coming from an iphone or even a windows phone I'm looking at the home screen and there's five icons along the bottom and I'm like gee I wish I could do something else with this blank space now of course the center area of the screen is used for multitasking which is great but I want quicker fast access to maybe a widget or more than five well that's actually five icons one of which you can't change though it's only four icons I would have liked them come out with some new version of webos that really pushes what makes webos great which is multitasking but adds a lot more flexibility in terms of ease of access of applications and customizing if they just are moving way too slowly with that and and and the pre three is not coming out till the summer really come on I mean by the summer we're going to have probably of quad core phones by then we'll have the iphone 5 we will have a lot of really good hardware we still have ctia coming in in a couple of months and there's new stuff coming out and Evans going to be at ctia by the way um yeah you're gonna have an interesting point there i think this was the it's might have been the first time i've ever seen a company both both announced a new phone and then also announced the availability of its predecessor or at the same event haha which a writer I was just I was scoffing you continue please yeah you know basically it was like you know we have this great new phone coming out and an ojeda's older phone that that we announced like you know three months ago and people have known about 4 45 months or whatever is finally on on pre-order her starting next week or something you know it's just it's sort of ridiculous I've never never seen anything really like it i think this sort of it there's sort of stepping on their own toes there and you know how they can expect sales of pre to to be all that creative the people who are really interested in tamil ice know that i'm sewing leather last know that if the the 33 is coming out in just a column on yeah it's it's a it's almost a bit of a tragedy with the timing i mean if a company gets timing wrong on a new product it can be the difference between its success and its failure i'm not saying the pre three is going to fail but by the time the summer comes around what seems like a cool device today is not going to seem that cool anymore unless they price it very low or they they do a software upgrade between now and then but it's just it's it's a shame that the veer will be cooling and it's it's coming out relatively soon which will be nice although there's no word on which carrier is going to severe but I think it just went through the FCC and i believe it was with the gsm bands so one would think it would be either 18 tiara for tmobile probably a PMT yeah not sorry about that um palm veer or web web OS what was the HPV is what they're calling it video playing there yeah so we'll see what happens with webos you know we like competition and we wish for the success of webos it's a great operating system and and hopefully it will stand the test of time so let us move on here so HTC is talking about new devices on Tuesday at Mobile World Congress we're pretty sure that they're going to announce three different products last year if you remember they were they announced the legend the desire and the wait is that right yeah the legend the desire and the HD Mini so kind of the number three seems to work very well for HTC and this year we think it's going to be the desire HD to which should be awesome their high-end flagship phone and then the desire to which we've seen leaked as the the saga and the Wildfire to which will be sort of a lower end android smartphone with probably a lower resolution display we kind of have an idea of what the specs will be like for the desire HD two it's probably going to have a dual core processor with with a lot of RAM it's going to have a you know the same 4.3 inch its screen that the current desire HD has which is rolling out across the world or at least to AT&T tomorrow what did I or oats today actually so if the desire HD two and what we know about it is going to be true I'm curious to what you think Evan because you wrote the dear HTC please step up your game article do you think this is good enough for two thousand yeah if the rumored specs turn out to be true it it'll be pretty good it it sounds like their stomach doing bluetooth 3.0 which which I know a lot of people are annoyed at considering you know Samsung even algae I've been incorporating that for a while I think it has it's going to have a lot to do with the form factor of the phone yeah it seems that Samsung is able to pack a lot of high-end features into you know apparently the thinnest smartphone in in the world at least up to this point so HTC is not really able to do the same and I think it's going to be considered a loss for them hmm well we know we know the form factor of the desire HD two I mean it's gonna look like we don't know what it's the desire to oh well I met the desire HD two but I don't think we do know the four back are doing well it's going to be a slate device you know it's going to look like this current desire HD but probably thinner maybe a thinner bezel and what else what I mean that you know the specifics on that you know the Devils in the details and that's what it's really gonna come down to is you know how thin is it you know how how thin is the bezel you know what did they do with the industrial design what kind of materials are they using today for real ass on it all these things are going to be important guess we'll have to see HTC your right is one to bring forth some details hopefully they're going to be more than just you know you take off the back battery cover and you see orange or yellow as they dish with a lot of their recent devices but the add the desire to it looks just like it's and we have seen pictures of this all over the place it's going to look just like its its predecessor just a little bit cleaner and so if that trend continues then the desire HD two is going to look very similar to the desire HD but of course we will have to see also with these new devices HTC's going to talk about their new version of a sense interface for Android I think we're up to three no no and we got a little tip about what it what it will entail we think that there might be something having to do with transparency with with widgets although that's less certain than the redesigned application tray so you know in HTC Sense applications you get the little slider along the bottom an email for example you can filter between unread messages black messages and so on in the application tray for sense three-point oh you'll have presumably three different options on the bottom one is favorite applications ones downloaded applications one is all apps which is great because right now when you hit the apps button it's an endless list of apps and you know since three point 0 will really really help with that but what else could HTC due to their sense interface have either of you used there there's their interface for Android I've used down the hero all right that was a while ago that was the that was the first gen of sense and how about you custom rom but I don't remember right how about you haven't used have you sense yeah but a while ago on on custom roms and on windows mobile hardware sure well I've been a following the the changes and since very very closely and the difference between generation 1 and generation to was that with two you got some more widgets you got ties to HTC Sense calm it was faster a lot of marginal changes I mean nothing really that significant they rearranged the personalized menu so you can flip through your live wallpapers and your regular wallpapers like cover flow for since three point oh I would love to finally see an option to turn off sense and I know they're not going to do it but a lot of people really appreciate sort of a clean light interface and you can't turn off sense very easily there are some workarounds you can use your own home screen launcher for example but then when you go into email you're still seeing sense when you go into the dialer you're still seeing sense it'd be nice to see something different there yeah you're right I don't think that's going to happen yeah and and and along those lines let's say that they don't give you the option to turn off sense they should have the option to customize those little sliders along the bottom in my email application I never ever ever go off the first tab which is I'm looking now it is just all or what they call they just call it received and then they have conversations favorites unread marked meeting invitations attachments come on I mean people really use a lot of this stuff it'd be nice to turn off certain you know elements to the sense interface and even rearrange these little buttons along the bottom but these are just little wishes that I have and they're probably not going to do to bring those changes forward because they want to control the experience and rightly so so for you it's just taking up space really yeah yeah it is and in my mind I I think that means it's slowing down my device it's probably not true but when I see more stuff on the screen i think my device is slower so cool so yeah so that's Tuesday for for HTC and then tomorrow or probably by the time you're listening to this on on Valentine's Day LG is holding a press event they're going to talk about the same devices they talked about at CES but they're going to add the Optimus 3d which was actually announced in a press release today and we were talking about this in the last podcast or pocket cast about what a 3d display would bring to the smartphone experience and we kind of have an answer here it's going to do 3d video and 3d images glasses-free which said it should be pretty cool but it doesn't look like they're doing anything to the to the interface here in terms of making it you know 3d capable I don't know if we know that yet either way we do know that it would be able to teach you how to perform yoga so they're going to they're going to pick up a huge segment of the market that video was hilarious did you see that video had him oh this this girls are optimist 3g and then she's watching a like a TV show and she's like I don't understand this and she takes out our 3d optimist and sets it on the mat and silently images start popping out and she's like oh now I get it this is how you do yoga it's kind of hilarious yeah I've gotta wonder though I feel like this was rushed to the market a little bit just to be the first 3d smart phone I could imagine that playing video back is going to be a little weird you know the glasses-free 3d stuff that's out there right now isn't even close to ready huh so maybe it's not the case if you're talking a smaller form factor lower resolution but I guess we'll have you seen I think you have to remember too that that if you look at LG as a whole as a bigger company there they have a lot invested in 3d you know not just on the phone side but but especially on the TV sub yeah on the home theater side so they're they're going to want to to make that whole experience around you know for could you be able to bring 3d content from you know from your from your blu-ray player your TV to your phone and and and so obviously I made part of that is getting some some penetration with these mobile devices too so you know what they say no one's going to make content for this stuff until they're so I'm not some hardware out there and and I think that's what they're doing right now is just trying to get some you know this stuff in people's hands even a folk you said it's not a hundred percent runny / for consumers or does not there's not as many applications for it as as there may be in a few years yeah fat point I mean once they get this stuff out there and I'm sure though they'll release an SDK so the developers can make 3d apps hopefully other companies will follow suit but then are we talking about multiple 3d standards and multiple SDKs will be pretty detrimental to the 3d handset market yeah I think it will be like different codecs you know me right now you have quite a few codecs and devices are partly judged on how many when they can support and I can't go probably the same for 3d good point good point it's interesting to see how all these companies that make more than one product try to bridge together all of their different products and you know we saw this and we saw this this week with palm talking about how palm does you know tablets now and smartphones and computers and printers and servers and they want to link them all together and then you know LG has similar ambitions and it's it's interesting to see that all of these electronic OEMs are doing phones now and they're thinking about ways to tie their stuff together but then you get stuck in a certain ecosystem and you feel compelled to buy an LG TV or a sony TV so it works exactly what they want I must be a big sucker then I really like my I like my samsung TV and my samsung phone I was driving down the road today and I saw a samsung bulldozer and that was kind of fun here did you want to get word I wanted to get one just a bit you know just to say I have it my name is seen a glasses list 3d screen I saw it at CES on a like 52 inch display and it was very difficult to see because you have to stand exactly in the right spot and the resolution was definitely far lower than HD so my understanding was it wasn't there yet but apparently it is there and while I mean yet the Nintendo what do they call it the three here what is the name of that three BF 3 DS yeah so apparently it's there for smaller sizes it's good enough and who knows maybe maybe this is the next the next thing maybe the desire HD two will have 3d evan maybe that's one of the little surprises lastly I really like how they did 3d effects on the zune HD remember that hmm very subtle but as you're moving you can see that the elements that were higher up we're moving in a different rate and if you tilted it they would move slightly at a different angle as if it was 3d it was using an accelerometer Oh little 3d effects in their kind of like the the photo gallery in stock Android I don't have you ever seen that if you tilt the device it kind of looks like the elements are moving so I know what you mean yeah that is a that is a cool effect I mean it it makes for a more pleasant experience perhaps or maybe as well find it in a year 3d doesn't belong on a phone just like maybe dual displays don't belong on a phone a lot of experimentation right now it's it's kind of cool to see all these different ideas yeah very good so let's move on let's see so on let's see we were talking about tuesday the verizon iphone 4 became available in stores and everyone was expecting massive lines in fact i was going to go to a verizon iphone store in in center city philadelphia to interview people in the line but apparently the Lions didn't happen why didn't the lines happen a good question I mean that the pre orders were certainly popular or not didn't they did they sell they turn through like two million phones and 22 hours or something right so I don't know maybe maybe the whole the whole culture of there being such long lines for iPhones actually you know kept people away this time you know everyone thought there was gonna be line so so no one showed up in there were no alarm I mean this is obviously a phone that people want so it's not like they're not going to tell them you know maybe verizon made it easier to order it online or or you know you get it through best buy and it's available in more places on launch I mean that there could be a number of reasons I think and I'm sure we'll find out yeah that's that's got to be the truth I mean if you look at the iphone for lunch some of the thea the dodos that stood in line for 11 hours hint me i stood in line because I thought that I wouldn't be able to get one I didn't think supply would be high enough i thought i'd have to wait wait until you know a few weeks game around but with the case the verizon iphone 4 it's a device that is presumably been in production for a while you can get at multiple places as you imply devon and you know there's no procedure you know lack of inventory so there people aren't lining up maybe people did go to the verizon stores they just didn't line up in the morning maybe they went when they got home from work or something plus those cold out so it's not really that much fun to go the interview that eats then in a line in the cold great point we've got to remember that the verizon or the AT&T iphone launched in the summer so that's a different story i guess people are more tolerant to heat than they are to home and Steve Jobs didn't announce it so there's no reality distortion field there haha yeah no one told them if you didn't tell people to come by it they get it to go that's funny someone at verizon said buy it but yeah without Steve Jobs I mean people aren't going to be able to make buying decisions anyway all right so let's move on we've got a couple more stories to talk about we've got ie9 switching to windows phone 7 ie9 possibly or definitely coming to Windows Phone 7 in the mango update although we're still waiting for the copy and paste update what significance do you think this has on windows phone 7 Adam D have you been using IE 9 on the on the desktop yes it's i 9 verses i 7 on the desktop is a huge difference the performance increase is great the user interface sign is excellent there's just so many improvements from i9 arise under 98 on the phone it's a little different because when this phone sentence version of ie really works pretty well now it's it's fast smooth just assuming that all works really nicely there's no there's not a lot of float in the interface it's very clean design mm-hmm so having ie9 come to that I think it's really more about the standard support and html5 so they're going to work to make html5 work really nicely on the phone so I think that's the big deal about I am yeah I think I think it would be nice and I think what they're trying to do is maintain the same level of speediness and windows phone 7 as I I think the best browser of any platform even better than an iphone 4 they want to keep that speediness while adding the html5 compatibility do you think they're going to do flash yeah we don't know that sure about that hope I mean they'd like you right yeah it has to be more on the end of Adobe um you know if you only have a limited amount of people to work on this stuff you're you're obviously going to concentrate on the Android and and you know other platforms I think that that you probably perceive as you know having more penetration yeah I think the best way to implement flash on browser will be one of the options well you can have it plane right away everything loads at once and potentially bogs down your whole system you know I that's a really interesting question I tend to you know an Android you can specify either to not load flash to ask to load flash or to always load flash and i have it set to ask to load flesh but I i just wanted to load and I don't have it just load because then the page slows down so I'd love to see a somebody get this right where flash will always load you it doesn't have to be a question but the browser performance is not in acted we're not there yet and maybe multi-core processors on phones will finally allow for that yeah here's okay you know I the nexus s the inspire 4G by my count not including you know the optimus 2x are the fastest or one of the fast two of the fastest phones out there and both of them can do this flash thing but it's it's barely flash because you've got to decide if you wanted all the time half the time or none of the time it's just not the true sort of internet experience that I would hope that we would be able to have these days a lot of flash sites aren't really optimized for finger input either yeah that's another big problem I mean you go to like a restaurant website with a menu or some sort of flash animations just not made for your finger it's made for a mouse clicker so even like a mouse over effect you have to move your mouse over the thing for some things to show up or anything to happen yeah they don't they don't really translate well to the mobile experience so ie9 hopefully will will be cool on a mobile phone ringing better performance when the heck is this copy and paste update coming haha we don't know they said within the next few months is the official statement yes that's hard bandit got me a base that's complicated yeah I don't understand it I don't understand why they couldn't have rolled us into the first release of windows phone seven unless there's some underpinning impact I mean they have to I guess code some sort of virtual clipboard and all this but can't be that difficult it and maybe I'm wrong I don't know we need to get Gabe in here to opine yes Gabe is our resident genius when it comes to all things technical related to smartphones so perhaps he could shed some light on like copy and paste is so challenging in Windows Phone 7 we saw in the end of a emulator remember yeah yeah it's in the emulator it's there it works and i'll get it on a phone even the first one you could you could do control see if you have your keyboard on the and here I didn't know that there you go so it was there since it was in there just that the UI aspect was there at the first very good and one more thing we wanted to talk about here so you know where we're getting close to the next release cycle of the iphone well if not getting close but close enough to where we can sort of talk about it and there's a rumor there there's a rumor that there may be a mini iphone sort of to have a lower price device too I don't know what would this accomplished I'm surprised ever done is already very honest with you I'm surprised that there's not a whole lot iphone that's a good question don't you think that that could I don't know dilute the the iphone brand a little bit way that it's a billion-dollar brand you know like any other company day they should be leveraging that and trying to trying to expand it even more and there's still tons of people that would love an iphone and can't afford one and you know apples goal should be to get iphones into those people's hands and that's part of what they were doing by continuing to talk or the 3gs of our prices but you know they need to go even further and have stuff that that's absolutely free on contract hmm animal you say huh oh I was just agreeing they've got all the old ones are still available on that all but those are there for the lower end purchasers hmm I'm not sure that people necessarily want like last generation hard work you know they want stuff that's that's new that's just not as expensive i'd like to see somebody Apple Google figure out a way to make data plans cheaper because I think hey that's the biggest sticking point when people are getting new phones you know the upfront fee is annoying it gets expensive but the the recurring data charge is just it's killer it adds up so fast that's why the phones are so cheap though Brandon I mean you know we wouldn't be getting these these five hundred dollar to eight hundred dollar phones for you know hundred two hundred box if if they weren't making a ton on the service so now you can you can get get you know cheaper Gaeta as you did with recording your your google voice number but the chair up is you have to pay a lot for the hardware yeah that is a very good point that's a very good point I mean that equation works perfectly so you go buy a nexus s on tmobile from best buy and you pay five hundred and thirty dollars for it but you don't have to sign it to your contract but you paid five hundred and thirty dollars for it so it's a it's the trade-off you know in obviously other countries it's sort of the opposite you buy an unlocked phone for 600 bucks and then your plans are cheaper because they're not subsidizing the cost of your handset so guess it all depends on sort of how you look at things if you want a bigger upfront cost or if you don't mind spreading that cost over many months hmm oh I wish they had a I don't know other ideas so yeah iphone mini could be cool I think there's an opportunity there but you can't go I don't think they'd go much below 3.5 inches I mean I don't think they'll change the screen size at all two jobs you know this is the perfect size yeah nothing else is good nothing nothing else is good and now you have to give you the beer now don't you Oh beer has a keyboard on right knee right though well now you're gonna have to have a small i phone with keyboard I think I mean I beer is clearly going to take over that check that segment of the market and this is Apple does something to stop it the mini mini phone segment of the market what activities was there yeah exactly doesn't that segment exist I mean obviously people have no problem carrying 4.3 inch screen devices in their pocket this 55 year old family friend was over the other day and he had a droid x and I said don't don't you mind how you know you're old and you know Here I didn't actually say that Tim I said you're older don't I mean it you know we grew up with this tech we don't mind carrying large things in our pocket but what about you you know he recently came from a flip phone he said you know it's not that big of a deal and I think that we're all hooked on these larger screens and this this segment of mini phones i don't know if that even exists i mean did the palm pixi so well i don't think it's sold so well that was a 10 real thing with the beer that that clip on USB port / you know 3.5 millimeter jack that's gross if it's going to want to carry that around and Johnny out of the phone that I don't I don't know what they were thinking there so you can't charge your phone unless you use that appendage or you use a touchstone of course oh of course the touchstone that's a great way to get people to buy the touchdown obviously all right touch tones cool it is cool yeah it's gaining functionality to what kind of functionality well now they have it so when it's docked there's a special API that you can make a do stuff when it when it's there you know alarm clock or different types of budgets and I forget what they call it exactly but but it was a whole it was a feature they were counting with about webos 2.0 ah it's kind of cool idea you know you don't have to mess with chargers but just start throwing them in for free putting them in the box you know make our unboxings a little bit more interesting they don't even include headphones anymore I mean are they going to stop including Chargers next next next time write Braille battery byob very very good and um all right well I think I think that's all we want to talk about obviously a lot more news to come on mobile world congress the next time we do the pocket cast we're probably going to be talking a lot about what HTC unveiled were eagerly waiting to see what they have in the store and and yeah a lot of really interesting things happening in mobile this week so Adam and Evan thank you for joining me on the on the Pocket cast episode 3 here yeah and thanks everyone for yes thanks everyone for listening and we'll see you next time that's it for now