Gadgetory

I'm very excited about our next guest she's been covered technology for 25 years 10 years on Microsoft she's the author of Microsoft two point oh how microsoft plans to stay relevant in the post gates era and sure hoc nazi dnet has been for a week baseline let's just get around here ladies gentleman please welcome Mary Jo Foley we're doing work be careful with the sofa oh boy oh we yeah nilay during during the interview neil i push the so far I think straight on it it's fine you something any sudden movement l Mary Jo thank you for being here really really appreciate so we wanted to UM want to have you on cos going talk about Microsoft I don't know if you've heard they've been the news a lot lately hi yeah mmm what was that is everything okay are you all right sir okay good uh-huh Microsoft has been in the news a lot lately you've been covering my cover Microsoft you get some fantastic scoops they don't when I see them I don't get angry or sad I just think what a great scoop not I wish I had that scoop anyhow but you do you can't you even covering Microsoft for a long time and you really know them and all the people there yes ah they've just announced some pretty major stuff i mean windows 8 we knew was coming right we knew there was me another version of Windows Phone mm-hmm the surface is not something that was necessarily like a slam dunk like oh yeah of course they're gonna do this yeah what did your take on that I mean what do you think is this is this the right strategy for Microsoft in 2012 to make their own tablet their own pc essentially but what is your what do you think all I can tell you is until I saw that surface I kind of thought windows 8 was gonna be a disaster really but once I thought I was like okay now there's hope there's a hardware form factor that it's got me really excited so you say up until the surface as want to be clear yes you were like Windows 8 total mistake you didn't see any partner hardware no Suh snow HP I it all kind of felt the same to me and I really wanted something really exciting cuz I have an iPad yeah I shouldn't say what no I know you actually wrote you come on we're gonna actually actually if I can if I can digress for one quick second you wrote a post years ago when you got your iPad and it was a guy got an ipad and we had this big debate when we were at engadget we're like sure we cover this I was like well Mary Jo buying an ipad doesn't seem like news we had this big debate and we actually ended up creating was it engadget all yeah we ended up creating engadget all because really we want to be able to hit the stuff that is like interesting to us but not news necessarily so any I'm you actually brought a lot of that thinking to the verge so you're sort of you basically are the reason we exist when you think about your purchase of an ipad but you say you bought an ipad i bought an ipad in fact there was a headline somewhere that said blood rains down on the Holy Land the day I bought my iPad who wears a bit I just like those kind of really explosive head lies exactly yeah but you know the reason I bought an ipad was because I couldn't find a windows tablet that I loved cuz they're all terrible they were all terrible just terrible like he's beyond horrible I mean it bill gates if that was the gates vision yeah he needs glasses right agreed well he wears glasses he's stronger glasses he needs x-ray vision I don't know what he needs but hey I'm go go on yeah so the but when I saw the surface and I haven't even gotten to see one in person yet like I've just seen pictures I've seen one in person you have I've seen it and I was allowed to touch it briefly uh yeah for a moment you couldn't really use it it's a nice piece of hardware yeah it is really nice and I will say that I felt maybe that's how you felt but they've been telling this story and I spoke to people you know Microsoft wraps I'm sure you talk to the same people and they're like you'll see you'll see we've got a plan and I was like I don't get it like this thing's not good to use on a laptop and your tablet offerings are garbage at the moment you know nobody's really making a great wind it's like it's not just that the software doesn't really work that well but it's like the hardware just isn't that right so it was like how is this going to work and what is this this transitional device where I'm going back and forth and when I saw the service and I saw the what do they call them smart covers no smart cover is wrong vendor smart cover is Apple touch their type cover and touch kiya hai public Oh smart I could see how this would work I you really see this working but but why but why Microsoft why aren't they partnering why didn't they go to partners and say we want five you guys to make these thing I know I wonder if they did you think I can get them to make them you know you can get you can get a susan samsung to do almost almost they'll do anything yeah at all or doesn't have to be making stuff either like take him out you know anyhow I'm sorry I don't know where I'm going with this but but yeah why buy microsoft no I I'm not totally sure why they decided to take the plunge because you know it's not a really popular move with their partners as you might imagine but yeah they've been very quiet about that uh at least on the record they've been quite well didn't who said it was like a sister or a sursum okay I was good too it was uh yeah it was a acer right yeah thank you honey she yeah they prepared the idea he's like oh it's just it's just a gimmick don't worry this is just a fake thing they're not gonna go through well they don't have a choice and what do you what are you gonna do if your dell right you're gonna leave windows Dells basically but they said they're not really doing consumer stuff right but I any of any of you if you make laptops and you're out apple what are you going to sell if you go away from my desk and that's kind of like Mike I think Microsoft is neural goblets and funny linux we're gonna set up yeah linux desktop that's real Mary Jo that's real funny you keep cracking jokes figure this out figure cell linux dell try dad y'all was doing this right kind of trying they're like always doing this kind of feels like Microsoft woke up and was like oh they're all screwed we can do whatever we want and they're just kind of doing whatever they want I mean they're gonna make a phone eventually I guarantee it so do you Mary Jo do you think windows 8 will be a success and do you think that that what is success for windows 8 and then what is success for the surface yeah all the small you know you know what all right um I think Windows 8 is gonna be successful on tablets and not just on surfaces I think on a touch tablet it's a really interesting and good user interface I think on PCs especially for business customers uh maybe I mean not as sold on that one so but but business customers are really important to Microsoft they are I mean they're really important yeah if you were to i mean just and you tell me cuz you're the expert I'm just nothing I don't know anything but uh if if Microsoft were to lose I'm to saying like suddenly it lost its enterprise customers would it be in business no okay so they kind of have to make those people happy video although you know if you look at what they did with Windows Phone okay not a gigantic seller but I'm one of the three percent of Mary Mary has you talk back said she has a windows phone I didn't want to know I have the HTC trophy which is the only one right now in verizon yeah cuz freising was like why wait was there one clap I heard one I literally a single set of hands come together one time it was like no come on we have our own shirts we are the three percent you do like the Occupy that's us but you know like I don't wear what how should I feel about the three percent cuz the one percent they're bad right they're bad or evil they gotta be sauce they're just downtrodden the three presenters still super rich right everybody there they're like but the Masters of the Universe we think tit with women they can afford a windows phone and then the iphone that they actually yeah but we think different and I don't have a knife wait what you think different have you heard that somebody yes if we got to be real mixed messages going on here I'm still curious about the first answer of surface saving windows a just from a consumer perspective it is it that was all they were lacking I feel like they have a ton to prove consumer wise not just in hardware they have a ton software yeah to prove I you know again I think with a tablet your hardware experience is so tied to the software experience you know like when people see an iPad what draws them to it it's not the software like people don't go wow I want that operating system you know they want but actually they don't say those words but do they even think that well okay but but but hardware will only get you so far right hardware is like when you turn it on if it's a terrible experience you're like oh god yeah it doesn't matter how stack to the hard work I mean let me put it this way i think the n is it n900 I'm galleries get to Lumia sit n 900 no Lou me a 900 the Lumia 900 so I'm thing at the n9 yeah can they just figure out a better gaming scheme was the n9 the 800 and the 900 it's confusing but i think the 900 is the most beautiful looking piece of hardware in phones on the market but because of this offer and because of some hardware limitations just in terms of what they put in it i mean i wouldn't buy it and i think a lot of people feel that way you know and so so it will only get you so far but it helps it helps a lot it does but what will be great as if you pick it up and it's also like an amazing software experience but where they haven't got I mean that the HP TouchPad was a nice piece of hardware well there was alright that's very sad all right so let me let me let me shift gears a little bit here well not completely but so Microsoft posted its earnings recently 492 million dollar loss but they had this a quan of write down of 6.2 billion dollars which is no laughing matter they paid how much they mean for skype 8.5 billion which is insane by the way that number makes this estimate all right but how are they as a company like where do you rank their health right now in other areas their performance is actually quite good yes so they have a big growth the entertainment device division so I'm just curious to know like where do you what does that mean is it all even out yeah you know when I looked at their numbers this time cuz i look at them every quarter when they come out obviously what struck me is what's still powering Microsoft is their enterprise software so products that some people in this audience might know sharepoint whoo come on are you rocking sharepoint go on office system center all these enterprise products right this this is what is powering Microsoft and so as long as these products continue to be healthy they can keep taking losses on things that they're kind of thrown at the wall and seeing with so they're just gonna sell windows 7 for a decade like they did with XP and like see that's really it's super sad I media is that I mean I guess the question is like is that as other people move into their spaces that you've got google coming on strong apples not you know believe me i'm sure if they get their hands on an enterprise customer they're working hard to do that you know as their products becoming less and less they become less and less desirable certainly to consumers doesn't that have a kind of echo effect and by the way i just want to preface I nobody thinks I'm like a I'm like the worst kind of workers I gave the Lumia 900 a 7 out of 10 but I am excited about eight and I'm excited about the the surface I mean from what I saw I really liked it and so I have like this hope that this is going to be the thing that the kind of changes their placement in the market you know the minds of consumers but but if they keep losing consumers if it isn't you know and if they have are on this little bit of a downward movement in the consumer side doesn't that eventually pull away from the enterprise with all these other forces competing yep I I'd say you know that's that's the thing they're trying to hedge against and what they're doing right so they're they're kind of still very rooted in the enterprise but the ultimate plan i think is to start turning things around starting with windows 8 it's it's going to be a long process i think they know it's not going to be an instant overnight success I don't think I I think even in the most optimistic Microsoft projections nobody is going to say Windows 8 is going to just come out of the gate boom and knock windows 7 off no it's not what's going on with the desktop I mean I think that's the thing right because windows 7 has people know it it's it looks like every other version windows right and what if what if this version doesn't stick that's too weird do they just try something else you know what I'm guessing is gonna happen and this is just a pure guess I know one for Microsoft told me this pure hundred procedures with people at the ready to hit this statement if it sounds really juicy OD yo I um I think you're gonna see after windows 8 comes out this October I think you're going to start seeing Microsoft change how often they do windows releases hmm to go to yearly or whatever right to go closer to yearly if not yearly right now it's every three years that's too long way and it's a lot of pressure everything years you get like you got to come with a big it's almost like when you look at Apple's doing they've you know the change from a lion to mountain lion is really iterative stuff like a service pack exactly yeah and if they call service packs up you know like actual they gave him names or something cuz that service pack whatever it might change my picture what does the windows 9 look like you can you tell us if I find you I would I actually writing a blog post I actually I asked I asked a microsoft rep who shall remain nameless being it he knows who he is I said you know we're at the surface event I said so if this is the transition then windows 9 won't have windows desktop and it will it you know he was like you don't really expect me to answer that question so and then yeah and then he winked at you and he threw a mouse in the car that's it really first I was like why a mouse like a live mouse but but but but there's a lot of deep said below what you just described would make a tremendous comic and I would like to see somebody pen that okay a couple things I wish we had more time we went if only I hadn't done that stupid intro a couple quotes and then I have a big question for you Ballmer said that the coming months it's that it's the most exciting launch season in Microsoft history do you agree or disagree agree a hundred percent this is like the highest pitch it is launched at like every single product that the company is about to be revved in the next 12 months and and and then on the flip side well I mean he's obviously excited but valves Gabe Newell said this recently I a day ago I think Windows 8 is a catastrophe for everyone in the PC space I think we'll lose some of the top tier pc oems who will exit the market I think margins will be destroyed for a bunch of people if that's true then it would be good to have alternatives to hedge against that eventualities I'm smirking because you know what his alternative was Linux well that is insane can you sit can you throw some more burns at Linux my guidance I could be like a half hour I Linux burns Mary J I I don't um I mean he we know he doesn't like Apple cuz they're too controlling right and now he's mad that Microsoft's gonna be more controlling right he just hates control right now which is why he wrote you know you don't agree you don't but you don't agree at this point haven't seen the surface you don't think Windows 8 is it you and described as a catastrophe though you did say prior to the surface you thought it was a disaster I don't boards you're off did you say disaster I think you did maybe I did I don't know um what it has to be disaster a disaster fee does that's what's waiting for you is that no hey I think I think like I said I think windows 8 is going to be very interesting on touch tablets and possibly on touch laptops I think people who install it on existing non touch laptops are going to be surprised if they haven't tried it already about what that experience is like surprise in a negative way that see that's very amazing so very sad those are the people who are gonna be installing it there i mean it's not everybody's gonna be a new pc purchaser well you know the way most people get windows anymore is getting it on a new pc most people aren't like you know techies they don't go to Tijuana legs it's kind of like we're gonna take our chances right but I mean but if you get it on a traditional laptop the experience is your Start menu is suddenly you're no more start button right there's no start button right it's a completely different experience like people will be shocked and confused like people who only know that you know who are using like it's gonna be a starter decks are you right now or something there's gonna be a learning curve was the learning curve for you like it was really weird for me it's really weird yeah I don't I I'll tell you i don't use windows 8 on my laptop that i use for work I don't well that's not a ringing endorsement use linux all right I didn't tell you that she loves she all right final final question and I wish we had more time I do I would we gotta have you come back maybe as we get closer to launch every October something we could do like a round real get some get rid of these games yes Gotama War II I get a real table through out here through Microsoft round I won't be here either Oh his Ballmer is Ballmer destroying the company oh the light question to end yeah just a little like because there was this Vanity Fair article there was like Ballmer's just spent the last 10 years dismantling Microsoft you but then I counter quench that is this whole write down of the quanta the nitrous is the end of the gates era yes and now we're truly in the balm rare I agree which is kind of like revisionist history no it's been the bomber here for a while yes I guess you just been like and Steve Ballmer is not the sort of man who lies and wait all right like he's there oh you don't know the boy is going scary he was he likes getting your car Ballmer's in the back seats they just drive just drive it don't say anything turn the radio to the sport station house where else no I I I don't think he's just been laying around waiting but I think he also was cleaning up some messes that were left to him when he took over as a CEO what were the messes of Bill Gates left to Steve over a number of projects are making money is that that they've kind of gotten rid of downplayed some things close divisions gotten rid of things like a cuanto you know like the quantum was not a great weapon agrees and yeah we have to write about Mary Jo thank you so much you got to come back I will Mary Jo Foley everyone